Quote: [..Suggesting that I am somehow responsible for the errors of previous individuals in any church history is as sill as accusing me of endorsing slavery because I am white and plantation owners were also white...]
I forgot about your Church's endorsement of colonial slavery. Just another Church atrocity for your Pope to give an insincere apology for. "It's not popular now, better distance ourselves from slavery" Good Grief!

Why don't you stay on topic instead of trying to obfuscate the basic issue---which is what God said in the bible, not whether His principles have been properly implemented by all people at all times.

You're going to have to deal with this obsession of yours about Catholicism on your own---and that's a psychological issue, not a theological one.

It may be sometime in the future before you are sufficiently disciplined to be involved in discussions with me on these topics.

Let's clear up the bull on JW's and war: 

"Who are no part of the world and learn war no more? Again, the historical record of the 20th century testifies: only Jehovah's Witnesses." Watchtower1992 Apr 1 p.12

The finger is quickly pointed at other religions for their involvement in war, describing their followers as "children of the Devil slaughtering their spiritual brothers". (Awake! 1985 Dec 22 p.10) Jehovah's Witnesses are proclaimed as unique for being the only loving religion on earth and the only one abstaining from participation in warfare.

This self-proclamation of uniqueness is far from correct; numerous religious organisations do not participate in warfare. These statements are another area that highlights the dishonesty of the Watchtower in attempting to convince their followers that they are unique and alone are acceptable to God.

What most Jehovah's Witnesses do not seem to be aware of is;
o There are a number of religions that do not participate in war
o Witnesses are neutral but not pacifists
o There is Biblical support for engaging in war

A little more from that article: [at Isaiah 2:4: “They will have to beat their swords into plowshares and their spears into pruning shears. Nation will not lift up sword against nation, neither will they learn war anymore.” So those doing the global preaching work about God’s Kingdom rule must ‘learn war no more.’ Jesus said that they must be “no part of the world.” (John 17:16) This means that they must be neutral in political affairs, not taking sides in the controversies and wars of the nations. Who are no part of the world and learn war no more? Again, the historical record of the 20th century testifies: only Jehovah’s Witnesses.]

Who do you have in mind that are doing the global preaching work, are neutral in politics, are "no part of the world" and learn war no more?
(Even if you find a couple of religions that fit the bill, does saying that in some way equal the atrocities committed by your Catholic Church?)
I would like to know who you have in mind because I honestly don't have a clue unless you are talking about some cult in a compound but then again they wouldn't likely be doing a global preaching work, would they?

Again, you interpret the scriptures to serve your beliefs.  If your beliefs were correct, that wouldn't be a problem.  But....

Guess you'll be beating your weapon into a plowshare instead of saving your wife---kind of a strange application of scripture, I think.

Quote: 

• June 14, 2017 4:09 PM PDT

   Reply Like Edit Delete

   0
• tom jackson  texasescimo
   
  [Again, you interpret the scriptures to serve your beliefs.  If your beliefs were correct, that wouldn't be a problem.  But....
  
  Guess you'll be beating your weapon into a plowshare instead of saving your wife---kind of a strange application of scripture, I think.]
  
  
  Are you really that dishonest? I can understand you being misled but that's just dishonest. Where did I say that I wouldn't protect my wife?
  
  (2 Corinthians 4:3-5) If, in fact, the good news we declare is veiled, it is veiled among those who are perishing, 4 among whom the god of this system of things has blinded the minds of the unbelievers, so that the illumination of the glorious good news about the Christ, who is the image of God, might not shine through. 5 For we are preaching, not about ourselves, but about Jesus Christ as Lord and ourselves as your slaves for Jesus’ sake.
  Mt 15:14
  
  
  
  
  EDIT: You seem to have changed the subject again. This was my question and you don't have to answer it just like you haven't answered my other questions but be honest and stay with the comment you are responding to rather than deflect.
  
  [Who do you have in mind that are doing the global preaching work, are neutral in politics, are "no part of the world" and learn war no more?

  (Even if you find a couple of religions that fit the bill, does saying that in some way equal the atrocities committed by your Catholic Church?)
  I would like to know who you have in mind because I honestly don't have a clue unless you are talking about some cult in a compound but then again they wouldn't likely be doing a global preaching work, would they?]

This post was edited by texasescimo at June 15, 2017 8:32 AM MDT

I asked you what you would do if your only option to protect your wife from rape was deadly force.  You still have not answered that question with a "yes."  All you have said is that your wife would be "safe."  I doubt your wife feels safe based on your reply.  I'm seriously concerned that you have not yet committed to preventing her rape. 

Your actual question was "would she be safe having you as a husband?"
"
I answered your absurd question but you never answered my question. If someone died while I was stopping them from raping my wife, that's on them, not me. If deadly force was the only way to stop someone from raping my wife, I would use it. Was it really that hard to understand? Do you feel better now? Did I answer your question in the exact words you wanted so you can go to your next absurd attack?

• June 14, 2017 12:32 PM PDT
• tom jackson  texasescimo
  
  
  [I am not "so bent on war."  I am appalled at people like you who think that  there can never be a just war.
  
  If a wife were being raped---and only deadly force could stop her attacker---would she be safe having you as a husband?
  
  Or would you only interfere if this was the 70 times 7th plus 1 time it was happening?
  
  I actually feel sick to my stomach because I have been too long exposed today to the putrid reasoning I have been forced to read and respond to.
  
  ----One of the fruits I recognize you by.]

Hi tom. I was actually doing research looking for the name of a Catholic Priest that was beheaded for conscientious objection. A brave soul in deed. Didn't find it yet but found this and remembered this thread. It appears that you as a Catholic are supposed to support what you think is a just war but that you are not supposed to abstain from self defense. Ironic isn't it, that you attack me with your misunderstanding of my belief.

https://www.usccb.org/issues-and-action/human-life-and-dignity/war-and-peace/statement-on-the-catholic-conscientious-objector-division-of-world-justice-and-peace-1969-10-15.cfm

Statement On The Catholic Conscientious Objector

This post was edited by texasescimo at July 8, 2017 3:54 PM MDT

Quote from tom: [So your position is that we should never have fought the Revolutionary War and that we should not have fought the Germans and Japanese in World War II---or do our brothers exist only when they live in close proximity to us.]

Who is the we in the first instance? Catholics in America trying to kill Catholics from England or Catholics from England trying to kill Catholics in America? (I'd say neither side were following Jesus and the Christian covenant as set out in the Christian Greek scriptures as I have already proven.
You are a little more clear in your other for instance in fighting against the Catholics and others in German and against the Japanese in WWII. Just think if Catholic Churches in Germany didn't preach the faithful in to the trenches, there would have been no holocaust or WWII.
Christians on the other hand have faith in God and Jesus and the biblical resurrection.

(Matthew 16:25) For whoever wants to save his life will lose it, but whoever loses his life for my sake will find it.


EDIT: Quote: [..-or do our brothers exist only when they live in close proximity to us...] Shouldn't that be directed to you? You're the one that would kill your brothers based on where they live, yes? Are not the Catholics in Germany that you would kill just as much Catholic as you?


Christians are known for their love for each other where ever they live. If you are willing to kill your brother for some political agenda then you need to check your heart and think what would Jesus do.

(John 13:35) By this all will know that you are my disciples—if you have love among yourselves.”
(1 John 4:20) If anyone says, “I love God,” and yet is hating his brother, he is a liar. For the one who does not love his brother, whom he has seen, cannot love God, whom he has not seen.
(1 John 3:10-12) The children of God and the children of the Devil are evident by this fact: Whoever does not practice righteousness does not originate with God, nor does the one who does not love his brother. 11 For this is the message that you have heard from the beginning, that we should love one another; 12 not like Cain, who originated with the wicked one and slaughtered his brother. And for what reason did he slaughter him? Because his own works were wicked, but those of his brother were righteous.
(1 John 3:16) By this we have come to know love, because that one surrendered his life for us, and we are under obligation to surrender our lives for our brothers. This post was edited by texasescimo at June 14, 2017 6:04 PM MDT

What would Jesus do, you ask?---probably roll his eyes reading what you are posting.  But watch out for a lightning bold anyway.

Because I am not a murderer? Sorry, if you think I should murder people just because some political head like Hitler or some Church head like your Bishops and Priest say so. I think that we should obey God rather than men.

(John 8:44) You are from your father the Devil, and you wish to do the desires of your father. That one was a murderer when he began, and he did not stand fast in the truth, because truth is not in him. When he speaks the lie, he speaks according to his own disposition, because he is a liar and the father of the lie.

(Acts 5:29) In answer Peter and the other apostles said: “We must obey God as ruler rather than men.
(Acts 5:42) And every day in the temple and from house to house they continued without letup teaching and declaring the good news about the Christ, Jesus.

You use the words "kill" and "murder" as if they were identical in meaning.  You are a killer---you kill the truth of the bible with your interpretations.

The conquering of men in the Old Testament involved physical force.  The conquering of men with Christ is now by conveying and explaining the new reality so that we conquer their minds with the truth.

You display an incredible lack of insight.

If the JW's are banned in Russia, it's not because of what you teach. It is because you are unbelievably tiresome to be around.  It's just true that nobody suffers fools gladly---and your biblical interpretations are incredibly foolish.

Quote: "The conquering of men in the Old Testament involved physical force."

Why does your Church have a history of doing the same to Christians and everyone else?

Tiresome to you and other haters of truth.

(2 Corinthians 2:14-17) But thanks be to God, who always leads us in a triumphal procession in company with the Christ and through us spreads the fragrance of the knowledge of him in every place! 15 For to God we are a sweet fragrance of Christ among those who are being saved and among those who are perishing; 16 to the latter ones an odor of death leading to death, to the former ones a fragrance of life leading to life. And who is adequately qualified for these things? 17 We are, for we are not peddlers of the word of God as many men are, but we speak in all sincerity as sent from God, yes, in the sight of God and in company with Christ.

That was directed to the Jewish leaders.  Christ fulfilled the Mosaic Law and changed the way we are to relate to God.  You'll never understand the bible if you don't understand the new reality that God established when His Son redeemed the human race.

Quote: 

• June 15, 2017 7:03 AM PDT
• tom jackson  texasescimo
  
  
  [That was directed to the Jewish leaders.  Christ fulfilled the Mosaic Law and changed the way we are to relate to God.  You'll never understand the bible if you don't understand the new reality that God established when His Son redeemed the human race.]
  
  Not sure what post you are replying to? The Mosaic law has been fulfilled. I never said it wasn't. 

I reply to people like you to draw out their bias and error for all to see..

I have accomplished that to my satisfaction.  

I would continue, but getting my response to your posts to appear where I intend has become problematic---and hardly worth the effort required on this thread.

Given that only one of can be right in what we think, I'm sure we'll meet again soon.

I understand the Bible.
EDIT: I just don't understand your scriptureless post. This post was edited by texasescimo at June 15, 2017 9:05 AM MDT

Oh, I agree. You definitely have an understanding of the bible---unfortunately, it's just not an accurate one.

Glad you posted so many scriptures with your doctrines to show me the error of my way. You haven't even read the Bible. You just think it's okay to kill people from other Countries, other ethnicity, other political persuasion or tribe or whatever just because your Church told you so. Same with your trinity, immortality of the soul, indulgences, forced conversions to Catholicism, forcing priest not to marry, burning people at the stake, etc.