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Discussion » Statements » Rosie's Corner » If true that love of money is the root of all evil why not eliminate it? Go back to bartering. Moneylovers would disappear. Great, right?

If true that love of money is the root of all evil why not eliminate it? Go back to bartering. Moneylovers would disappear. Great, right?

Posted - February 14, 2018

Responses


  • 32527
    You would still have greedy people doing dispicable things to get more. 
      February 14, 2018 6:36 AM MST
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  • 113301
    More eggs and butter? More mowing lawns, washing/ironing clothes, repairing cars? Bartering involves service or product exchange. I mean I'll give you eggs and milk in exchange for your baking me your famous cakes. Do I  force you to bake more cakes as I give you less eggs and milk? I think it would be infinitely harder m2c. Thank you for your reply and Happy Valentine's Day Wednesday to thee!  :)
      February 14, 2018 7:10 AM MST
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  • 32527
    People take advantage of others all the time. Would it happen with bardering? Yes, it would/has/does.
      February 14, 2018 7:42 AM MST
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  • 46117
    Old School here....

    No, the root of 90%+ of human evil is Kin Selection, the notion that me, my family, my tribe, my locality, my religion, my nation-state, my ethnicity, etc.) has paramount interests to any other person, family, tribe, locality, religion, nation-state, ethnicity, etc.

    Money (or, more accurately, wealth/capital) is something which gets weaponized in pursuit of Kin Selection.


      February 14, 2018 6:59 AM MST
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  • 113301
    I think FEAR of the "other" dominates though I expect that you will say that is the flip side of kin selection. Correct? Thank you for your reply Old School via Sharon and Happy Valentine's Day Wednesday to both of you! :)
      February 14, 2018 7:07 AM MST
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  • 1340
    Hey Old School, just wanted to say it's good to see you around here again--been a long time (I happen to be absorbed by Fallout 4 of late). All the best to you and Sharonna. This post was edited by Danilo_G at February 14, 2018 3:24 PM MST
      February 14, 2018 12:32 PM MST
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  • 46117
    Hi Danillo,

    Just wanted you to know I dropped by to say hi.  You aren't here a lot so I want to make sure you know I said Happy V Day right back at you.

      February 14, 2018 7:18 PM MST
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  • 6023

    Because bartering only works on a small, local level.
    Most people wouldn't even be able to barter to get a car ... let alone an apartment or house.

    "I need to get an apartment ... I'll trade you 2 weeks of my skill flipping burgers."

    "I don't need that."

    So the burger flipper would have to find somebody with skills the landlord DOES need, and hope THAT person needed the burger-flipper's skill to barter.

    Nope.  Using money is FAR simpler than a barter system.

     

    EDIT:  Of course, then there's the problem of how do you pay taxes?

    This post was edited by Walt O'Reagun at February 15, 2018 10:42 AM MST
      February 14, 2018 7:19 AM MST
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  • 113301
    Your view is a bit narrow Walt. No disrespect intended. You ASSUME that someone who works in a burger joint has no other skills, talents, abilities. All he/she can do is flip burgers. I doubt that anyone is that limited. Perhaps that person is going to school and the burger joint is very accommodating to his schedule.  He might well be a genius at repairing things. Some people are. Perhaps he is studying to be a landscape architect i n which case he could do all the gardening you need done or an astrophysicist in which case he'd be a genius and could tutor your child in math or science.. People are not defined 100% by their jobs. That is to say they shouldn't be. Just my two cents' worth. If you are without transportation maybe he could provide you rides to wherever you needed to go. As for taxes people cheat all the time and use loopholes and other methods to not pay their fair share. A corrupt government such as the one doofus don promulgates will screw you no matter what you do or whom you are UNLESS you are one of the "chosen" ones. Anyway it ain't gonna happen. Too many folks (the ones who voted for and support the doofus) love money and he does too so they can relate. Just a thought from the Rosie Twilight Zone. Thank you for your reply and Happy Thursday! :)
      February 15, 2018 2:02 AM MST
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  • 6023

    My point was that there are people without skills they can barter for what they want.
    Even a genius may not have the skill set a landlord needs, in exchange for a place to live.

    Then those people would have to find a 3rd party with barter the landlord wants ... and try to barter their own skills to that 3rd person.

    EG: I have eggs to barter ... the landlord wants butter ... I have to find someone with butter, who wants my eggs.  Maybe the person with butter doesn't want eggs, but wants lumber.  Now I have to find someone with lumber who wants eggs, so I can give the lumber to the person with butter, so I can get the apartment.  And what if the person with butter leaves the area?  Or the landlord doesn't need butter the next month?  Now I have to start all over again.

    I still say cash transactions are much simpler.

    NOTE: If someone ever invents a replicator ... like in StarTrek or The Orville ... it will immediately render the need for money or barter worthless.

    This post was edited by Walt O'Reagun at February 15, 2018 7:42 AM MST
      February 15, 2018 7:33 AM MST
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  • 113301
    Before money was a medium of exchange what did people do to survive? Granted their wants/needs were far simpler. Survival was basically it. You need to pursue it further Walt. Does the landlord from whom you want butter not use eggs? Did you ask? Perhaps your eggs are better. Eggs/butter are not lumber so maybe you have nails or hammers available that he would need when he does find the lumber. It isn't a one-stop pitch. You figure out how to give the person what he needs so you can get what you need but to do that requires multi-dimensional thinking. Maybe in addition to eggs your wife is a seamstress and maybe his wife would love for your wife to sew her a pretty new frock as much or more than he wants/needs lumber. See you gotta keep pitching different avenues to explore because I think we all have many needs/wants. Don't you? Thank you for your reply and Happy Thursday! :)
      February 15, 2018 7:49 AM MST
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  • 6023

    Sure, we all have multiple skills ... but I used one for the simple reason that there are times when none of your skills are going to be wanted by the person you're wanting something from.

    There has been currency since before written history.
    Which tells me that people thought money was necessary even before they thought written language was necessary.

      February 15, 2018 12:22 PM MST
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  • 113301
    There will ALWAYS be multiple sources Walt. There won't just be ONE PERSON to whom you can go for what you need. Similarly you won't be the ONLY person able to supply that one thing others want. I guess we just gotta agree to disagree. You see limitations and I don't. You see if what you WANT is not  attainable you adjust the want to fit what is. Have you never done that? So what, right? Thank you for your thoughtful answer and Happy Friday! :)
      February 16, 2018 4:54 AM MST
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  • 6098
    My husband does some bartering.  I don't have the skills I could use to barter.  Well - not really. 
      February 14, 2018 7:22 AM MST
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  • 7280
    Money has two basic functions---it's a medium of exchange and a store of value (as long as inflation is relatively low.)

    Bartering works when the quid pro quo is close in value.  (As has been mentioned, buying a house for an individual would be difficult no matter what set of skills he had.)

    The size of the economy based on borrowing would be severely limited, and international trade would be rather difficult.


      February 14, 2018 1:02 PM MST
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  • 113301
    When was money invented tom? I'm gonna ask. What did people do BEFORE there was an agreed-upon financial system, however limited? You said it functions as a "store of value". I have read that almost overnight the value can plummet. Didn't  that happen in Venezuela at some time? My memory is fuzzy but if  it is that mercurial and unstable making it a store of value is like playing Russian Roulette. As with most things we impute value to it. It is worth what we say it is and has no INTRINSIC value at ll.  I'm not lecturing you m'dear because I know YOU know way more about these things than I do. Thank you for your thoughtful reply and Happy Thursday! :)
      February 15, 2018 2:08 AM MST
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  • 5391
    Why not?
    Because the electric company doesn’t take payment in favors.

    Because promises can’t buy gasoline, or Internet access, or groceries, or our own place to sleep. 

    Because roads and hospitals don’t get built on trading needlepoint or mowing lawns, and farmers can’t buy seed and equipment with homemade pies. 

    Barter? Good for neighbors, bad for nations. How many cakes for a college education? How much babysitting to keep the Army clothed and fed overseas?

    Money is NOT the root of all evil, the WANT of money is.

    Money is power. The power to live and do as we choose, to insure all our needs are met. The power to truly help others and raise our collective standard of living. Power to ensure opportunities for our descendants. 
    There is a class of living by dint of one’s dreams that Rosie and those like her will never join, endorse or even understand.
    Their loss. They are powerless. So they hate.

    Poor misguided paupers, blame the world for your low station. Your SS check is in the mail...


    This post was edited by Don Barzini at February 16, 2018 12:17 PM MST
      February 14, 2018 3:33 PM MST
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  • 113301
    Your tag line is extremely insulting DP. Why did you feel it necessary? Jim and I live on our social security plus some modest investments. We RENT. We are not paupers but we certainly aren't what you appear to be...wealthy and haughty and condescending and dismissive and disdainful. Thank you for your reply and Happy Thursday.
      February 15, 2018 2:10 AM MST
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  • 5391
    Indeed I AM wealthy, by dint of years of my own effort, by raising a successful business on my wits and sweat, and those of a group of fantastic people I employed. A source of great joy and pride.

    That said, I disdain the shallow mindset that you foment by (among other notable examples) casting dispersion on those of us who enjoy the abundant fruits of our labors. Fruits that roll down to all involved in the enterprise, that fuel economies and that pay the larger portion of taxes in this country. Fruits like advanced education, expanded opportunity, and personal power and privilege that seem so lacking in your little bubble. 

    You paint wealthy society with too wide a brush, complain about what you think you know about us, while creating false and inane narratives with which to slander successful people (among others in your slanted gaze) who, it is fair to suspect, you are covertly jealous of.
    Yet it is you who are insulted when caught in the act. How nice.

    I don’t waste any thought on your obsessive political rantings, Rosie, and maybe you notice very few others do either, but stray recklessly in this direction again, clueless and petulant, and I may drop another well-earned rebuke on you. This post was edited by Don Barzini at February 17, 2018 7:56 AM MST
      February 17, 2018 7:12 AM MST
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  • 46117
    Money is the symbol.  It has no effect whatsoever on the greedy heart.

    (speaking of Valentine's Day)

    Meaning, if we were to go back to bartering, the Trumps of the world would still try and better-deal everyone and see what they could do to swindle and get the most.

    It doesn't matter if it is paper, or land or lovers or whatever the greedy heart needs to fill that empty hole where love and gratitude and contentment are known to reside in the rest of us who take pleasure in sharing and giving and spreading joy, not grasping at it for ourselves alone.

    Happy Valentines Day to both you and Jim, Rosie.

      February 14, 2018 7:22 PM MST
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  • 113301
    Thank you for your thoughtful reply Sharon and the lovely graphic and Happy Thursday. Our day was good. I hope yours was too. I fixed coconut shrimp, asparagus and mushroom couscous! We were gonna indulge some dry rub ribs from Chili's but I felt like staying home and cooking. I know what you said is true. What did folks do before money was invented? I'm gonna ask. :)
      February 15, 2018 2:15 AM MST
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