God = court who sentences you to punishment (hell)
Devil = jailer who tortures you in hell
btw - I find it strange that people can believe a "loving god" would sentence anyone to eternity of punishment and torture, even if that person managed to live a mere 100 years of being "evil".
Yup, a loving god would not do that. Most governments do not allow torture although many have the death penalty. Hell is a misinterpretation by the translators. There is not a word in the Bible that should be translated as Hell. Everlasting life is a gift, not a punishment.
(Romans 6:23) For the wages sin pays is death, but the gift God gives is everlasting life by Christ Jesus our Lord. (Isaiah 57:16) For I will not oppose them forever Or always remain indignant; For a man’s spirit would grow feeble because of me, Even the breathing creatures that I have made. (Psalm 103:8-10) Jehovah is merciful and compassionate, Slow to anger and abundant in loyal love. 9 He will not always find fault, Nor will he stay resentful forever. 10 He has not dealt with us according to our sins, Nor has he repaid us what our errors deserve.
Yet you think a loving God would torture for eternity rather than just kill. You are way more loving than that 4th century nameless three headed monster.
Your understanding of my clear comment is similar to your understanding of the Bible. I am sure that there are people that are dead, most of whom will be resurrected in the future. The soul is not immortal and there is no literal hell fire.
The Commandment is "Thou shall not murder" (it was okay to kill other humans, in certain circumstances). Yet, that "god" told the Israelites to go and murder all the people who already lived in the land.
Not to mention that "loving god" wiping out the entire human race, except for one family ... rather than coming down and saying "Hey, you guys need to clean up your act before I get REALLY pissed."
Or the times he brought war and enslavement unto the Israelites, for "falling away" from him. I mean, how can anyone believe that - and not at least consider the possibility that The Holocaust was the same?
Nothing about hell there that I saw with a quick scan, if that is what you are saying?
Jehovah causing calamity at times for some doesn't mean that the God of the Bible creates or causes all calamities. Is 45:7 (NASB) The One forming light and creating darkness, Causing well-being and creating calamity; I am the LORD who does all these. Amos 3:6 (NASB) If a trumpet is blown in a city will not the people tremble? If a calamity(KJV Evil) occurs in a city has not the LORD done it?
It also say: "there is no other" so who else could.
That is the point I see Isaiah making. Only ONE god capable of doing such things. as an example BAAL is not a 'false god' though many people call him that. He cant do anything, he is just a fiction. as are all the other gods humanity have had through the ages. Saying Satan can do it turns Satan into a god comparable to 'the one god'. it is just silly.
No one made a literal hell fire. What is your definition of a 'false god'? In English, I think Baal qualifies as a false god? According to the Bible, there are many gods but only one true God. (God in Hebrew and Greek has a wider meaning than just the Creator or the True God.)
Well obviously then any other would not be the True God. Have you looked up and reasoned on the uses of god in the Bible? Have you looked up el, elohim, elohah, theos, etc in a concordance? I thought the subject was something to do with who punishes you in Hell. Are we clear that there is no literal Hell Fire in the Bible?
EDIT: How does this read to you? (1 Corinthians 8:5, 6) For even though there are so-called gods, whether in heaven or on earth, just as there are many “gods” and many “lords,” 6 there is actually to us one God, the Father, from whom all things are and we for him; and there is one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things are and we through him.
You really should study the bible before making biblical pronouncements. God does not punish people. Suppose Mommy tells Baby not to touch the stove. Baby touches the stove. Is Mommy punishing Baby by making him hurt? No, that is the natural consequence of touching a hot stove. Mommy warned Baby and Baby disobeyed. Not Mommy's fault.
That is exactly the situation in the garden of Eden. Adam could have eaten from the tree of life. It was there, and it was not forbidden. He chose to eat the forbidden fruit instead, and we all suffer from the consequences of that act. Not because God is punishing us, but because Adam screwed up and it's taking a while for God to straighten out the mess.
Meanwhile we have a devil who is very good at planting confusion. He tells lies about God by deceiving God's people and then blaming the deceit on God. He spreads confusion by inspiring stupid preachers to make up crap and preach it as if it came from the bible, and then he scolds believers because they believed the crap.
The only way you can protect yourself from this process is to study the bible yourself, ignoring everything you have been told it says. For example, people constantly tell you that if you sin God will send you to hell. The bible does not say any such thing. It says sins don't count, and hell is a grave, and everybody goes there, but God is going to raise everybody from the grave in the fullness of time.
And you probably won't study the bible because you don't actually care. That's ok, you're on your own.
What does Isaiah 45:7 mean to you. 7 The One forming light and creating darkness, Causing well-being and creating calamity; I am the LORD who does all these.
Assuming that anyone does in fact wind up there, what about the person that so changes himself by his actions in this life that he is unable to exist in heaven.
Or perhaps in His mercy, God ceases to support that person's existence.
That seems to satisfy both mercy and justice.
This post was edited by tom jackson at April 20, 2018 12:49 PM MDT
What are those that go to heaven going to do there? Where are those that are resurrected that are no going to heaven going to be living? Where are the wicked going to go?
A goat covered with blood from an animal became the devil. In ancient times people would confess their sins into a vessel of blood then the blood smeared onto a goat then the goat driven away into the wilderness removing the sins far away from the people. Then it was thought that the goat could absorb all these sins thus causing it to turn into a very evil beast. Then over the ages the red cloven hoofed animal with horns and tail achieved the status as 'the devil' and to rule the kingdom of Hades.
And quite likely just the same way concept of gods were created as iimages of man, woman and beast in ancient times then over the ages it was changed to man created in image of God.
This post was edited by Kittigate at April 20, 2018 6:10 PM MDT
The devil doesn't punish anyone in "hell". That's a misconception. The "punishment" people receive after judgement is the "punishment" they chose during their life here. There are only 2 choices (whether you like it or not) - eternal life with God or eternal separation (death) from God. If you don't want to live with God you're not going to. He won't force anyone to go to heaven. However, without God there is no "life". Just just loneliness, emptiness and agony. No light, no love, no joy, no mercy, no comfort, no pleasure and no relief. That's what "hell" will be. It's our choice where we want to be forever - with Him or away from Him.
People believe many things, much of it contradictory, some of it absurd. All cannot possibly be exactly right. All can possibly be wrong.
This post was edited by Don Barzini at April 20, 2018 4:32 PM MDT
Walt O'Reagun 