Did the BREXIT vote have anything at all to do with the rise in power of a Donald Trump? Was populism the root of Brexit? If not, what was?

I thought Britain should to leave the EU. Don't see the point in having any other country(ies) determine what an independent country should or should not do.
Something we agree on.....imagine that. LOL

LOL well now, wasn't there some quote somewhere about something making strange bedfellows? Meaning of course that yes we can find agreement in the strangest of places... We know that I LOVE reading and learning about the folk of the Ozarks and indeed anything like that... and we agree on Brexit...  We just disagree on Trump.

You don't think that Trump and Farage are basically the same?

that made me laugh.. if you look on here you will see how many times i have criticised Farage.. he is an IDIOT.. he isn't even a strong idiot.. he's a jester c clown.. .. he has less than zero respect here.. I could bore for england on that subject.. you misundestand seriously if you think he had any influence here... I've no idea why people think otherwise.. look at the papers here re Farage.. he isn't liked or respected.. he is a sycophant.. nothing more.. a Trump asslicker.. an itdoesnt do him any good.. I doubt Trump really respects him.. but remember the words Trump said re smaking Farage ambassador.. they fell on deaf ears here... we don't like being told what to do and no way we';d allow that joke to represent us... he's pretty much shunned here 

Sometimes you say things that are so out in left field that I don't know if you are serious or not.
You say he has no influence there?
You do realise he was basically the architect if Brexit???
That he basically made Brexit happen?
That's like saying Trump has no influence here. 
I feel like you're trolling me.
But I know you're going to probably say that I don't understand what you write since you do a lot of research . . .or something....
And you would be right!!

You're absolutely correct.  Nigel Farage was the driving force behind Brexit, he's not an idiot, far from it.  He said that once Brexit won he would step down and he did. 

I think that unless you live in the US it is impossible to fully understand the general feeling circulating among the people.  ..........."or something"  yes indeed!

Amongst the public here I'm willing to bet more would say y'all were justified in doing it than not.   Amongst those who have an opinion.
The concept of the EU doesn't make sense to most of the public here.
Most people here who are upset about it never gave two thoughts about it until Obama said it was a mistake.


In fact I have seen and talked to many liberals and Dems here who are weary of collective governments like the UN and EU.

What you describe as the reasons you liked Brexit and beieve it was the right thing to do my friend sounds exactly like populism. Doing what is best for your country. Thank you for your thought reply DdbTD and Happy Friday to thee! :)

Im not sure you understand what populism is.
Their intentions do not make the.movement right...that would be like saying Socialist Nationalism was right because they wanted the best for their countries. Or that terrorism is just as long as they keep their country's interests at heart.
Do you not think so?

"Voting for Trump was just plain lunacy  no other excuse".............  You've stated a fact that is disrespectful to all of the people who voted for Trump.  Please bear in mind that there are people on this site who did vote for Trump and comments such as this are insulting to them.  You can make a point without this lack of diplomacy. This post was edited by Benedict Arnold at March 17, 2017 5:44 PM MDT

I know you think that Sapph.as we have discussed it before.. but it really wasn't about one side doing a good or bad job.. there were many, many issues and a good deal of these aren't well understood by people in the states... they see the news and they see the simplistic views given... but I can tell you.. I voted Brexit... I never even saw anything about Turkey... so it isn't that simple....

How often do we hear about the fact that our fishing industry is dying because we aren't allowed to fish our own waters, and have quotas that are impossibly restrictive... while 5 miles out our fishermen watch while other EU nations fish as much as they want.. so our fishermen can't make a living while WE are forced to import EU fish...

How often do people hear about how our farmers are forced to pour much of the milk they produce down the drain... because of quotas again imposed by the EU.. while WE import loads of EU milk.. 

Sorry but that's not on.. and the list goes on and on. like how we can't sell our apples because EU imposes bans that are unfavourable to our apples.... and so on and so on and so on... 

And then there's the amount it costs.... WE were one of the biggest contributors financially... 50 million a day... every day... to support the rest of the EU.. we got very little back... yea I know it's sweet to support our neighbours.. Greece had a tough time a while back... BUT this is at the expense of our own country.. our NHS has become dangerous... our education system is seriously failing children due to funding cuts... and so on and so on....

And then there's the fact..that although many don't understand this...and although many think differently.. the UK has never really felt much of a tie with Europe.. we are close physically but most of us ally ourselves way more with Australians, Americans and Canadians... simply because of shared outlooks and language.. simply we were never that keen on Europe... just the way it is... and we SURE resented them placing more and more rules and laws on us that disadvantaged our businesses and our people....  sorry but that's the way we feel...or many do... 

I have asked this same question many times but it's always ignored.. to those Americans who don't think we should have voted to leave EU... how would THEY like being told what to do and not to do by someone outside the country?? They'd hate it and we know it. so why do they think WE liked being ruled by un-elected twits in Europe.

Re the immigration..  I am no racist and I treat everyone fairly.. just ask the loads of nationalities I work with daily... I don't discriminate against anyone. BUT those outside the UK should NOT dismiss the problems that such massive scale immigration has caused the country.. we are a TINY island... we are also already one of the most congested countries..we simply cannot sustain the levels of immigration... it places huge strain on our natural resources, housebulding mass urbanisation, loss of nature and wildlife, increasing habitat fragmentation, in many areas we don;t have enough water and the waste waster produced pollutes our rivers and streams for miles and miles and miles downstream...  and that's without mentioning the cultural problems caused by so many immigrants..nor the infrastructure problems not enough schools, hospitals, resources..

So I am sorry Sapph to disagree with you... but there were a whole load of other reasons why we voted for Brexit.. it wasn't a popularist vote ... it was a vote that indicated how many of us felt... 

This is kinda the opposite of Trump... cos most people didn't vote for him

Oh and another small point.. imagine a country where when you walk down the street, ANY street...in your own country... and you cannot hear your own language spoken... you hear every language but your own...you see every nation but your own... that's how it is here now.. you go into a shop and there are almost no english in there.. we don't hate any other nation or colour.. but we feel like aliens in our own country now...  I am all for sharing our country but the sheer scale now of immigration is untenable. Personally I think it's all too late.. as the number of children born to native people is way less than those born to non-native people. so in other words more people born here are now NOT British.. 

Did you really just say this? And where is the opposite to Trump on this one?

Yes, definitely said it.. I honestly believed what I wrote, it was written based on a first hand understanding of the situation here.. I appreciate, as I always have done, that you have a different opinion. I respect your opinion and that it's different to mine, but I feel respectfully that there are things that some Americans don't necessarily know about Brexit and why people voted it... So i was trying to explain those things as some misguidedly think it was just common people voting against immigration based on scaremongering.. I was explaining that is not the case to help gain a better understanding of what happened.. and more importantly why it's not the same as Trump

The reason it's not the same as Trump is cos a LOT of conservatives voted Brexit.. there were many high profile examples of top conservatives encouraging the country to vote Brexit.. This was cross party and if anything the Labour party were against Brexit... so factually here it was not a populist vote because many were rich and powerful people, intelligent people who debated and made their case intelligently.. Unlike Trump!  You see?   Trump almost never appealed to intelligent people..  so Brexit is very different.. 

My question was specifically about your comment on immigrants. Why is it okay to vote Brexit to avoid more immigrants whereas all Trump lovers are imbecile uneducated and whatnot for voting him saying the same words. The same Wilders did in Holland, and what Le Pen she will do/does in France. It is populist and used scaring people instead of suggesting how to deal with the world issues we face today. It won't disappear because we isolate ourselves behind walls or on islands. The issues are still there. And if not solved by the world leaders it will become a real threat at a time. And now I am sorry and have to tell you the way Brexit is looked at in the world from outside UK is very much comparable to Trump. I hold my word here, and I won't go into all the other stuff you wrote, we have debated that in private. I think you guys look at the premises of EU all the wrong way. Not much o do about it now, the losing side of your referendum did a poor job explaining what you were voting about. Polls showed the very next day how uninformed large parts of the protest voters they were, very similar to how Trump got his votes. There's a lesson to be learned here. Haven't seen establishment doing this very well in any part of the western world. This post was edited by Benedict Arnold at March 17, 2017 5:15 AM MDT

OK Sapph.. I am always happy to answer your questions... there is a huge difference..and I did kinda include this stuff in my responses but it may have got missed... so... for a start.. America is a HUGE country... huge.... big space, big resources.. Britland is TINY.. we are already one of the most congested countries in the world.. this means more people per acre of land than others..  this is important.. it means less space.. it means increased urbanisation.. it means loss of countryside, it means loss of wildlife and it means real difficulties re healthcare, education and other services.. in other words they are badly overstretched with the sheer number of people.. Now this isnt spin, it'snot opinion.. it's fact.. we cant just keep building new hospitals and schools.. we have land shortages and financial shortages... 
Fact too is that we don't have enough environmental or natural resources.. I cited water shortages.. too many people to sustain.. we cannot change this.. it's a natural limitation and we have suffered significant environmental pollution, (I mentioened this before) and degradation.. it's just fact... 
America is a very different matter.. there IS space at least and this means less pressure environmentally.. that's just a fact..

Personally  Ihave never criticised Americans for immigration ...just saying .. so it's not for me to answer that... however, as I have pointed out.. the facts in each case are very different as are the reasons why I personally object to too much immigration...  I am NOT objecting to any race or religion.. far from it and you will never see me do that.. My last but one bf was half Indian, and my last bf was half Pakistani, half Afghani.. I said I work with all nationalities.. and I do.. and hand on heart they would tell you I treat them fairly... and I treat them well.. I take a lot of time to help them... so no way I am akin to the racists and people who seem to have an irrational fear or hatred of people based on colour or religion.. so that's  a BIG difference.. 

I do appreciate that Brexit is looked at as similar to Trump.. fact is tho that there are big differences and some of these have been pointed out here. if people choose to ignore that and make overly simplistic and erroneous similarities, (NOT saying you as I know you do listen to debate) then really there isn't much I can do about it.. all I can say is.. well more fool them for believing hype and not taking the trouble to learn... MOST of them have no idea even of the arguements i have presented and I am far from expert... but what can you say.. some degree of ignorance is hard to fix... let them believe what they want.. as fact is people round the world are literally queuing up to trade with us.. so regardless of their having unfactual beliefs it wont affect us :) 

re polls... well we all know how good they are!! Not... i was interested in the ones that link Brexiters with education.. how would they know?? See they cannot know unless they ask.. no one asked me... or anyone I know. and as i say there were TOP conservative politicians arguing to Brexit.. so thats the point really... that despite the belief that exists in AMerica... the fact was this was cross party, cross politics and cross class.... many very rich people voted Brexit...

We looked at Europe as an unelected bureaucracy that drained millions daily from our economy but which treated us badly.. and made our farming, industry and fishing suffer less favourably than others..  

Your first sentence says it all.

"Trump almost never appealed to intelligent people..  "   and you know this because??????                  

"Unlike Trump!  You see?   Trump almost never appealed to intelligent people.. "

Yet, the majority of white college educated did indeed vote for Trump and 43% of all college educated voters voted for Trump. So yes there were educated people who Trump appealed too.

I am an intelligent person, I voted for Trump.

You have restored reality.
Honestly, I had to read that (her post) just to make sure I was not reading it wrong.
It feels like someone slipped a crazy pill in my drink.
Like some twilight zone episode, 

I just think I was as surprised as you.

You write all that and end it with, "That is kinda the opposite of Trump".
That blows my mind.