Discussion»Questions»Celebrities» Can you imagine doing the same job for 65 years? Queen Elizabeth has. Of course she has a lotta perks and no other skills. Right?
to be very fair -my historical knowledge is far from perfect but I understood that they tried as hard as they could to distance themselves from Nazism and they were head of a country, aka UK, fighting Nazism. I get that you aren't a fan of the Royal family, lots aren't so that's cool but I honestly don't think we can say that all people of German decent, or even all Germans are Nazis - they just aren't and never were. SO on this one not guilty I feel.
Sorry, Day, but you're wrong about the Royals on this.
Again, only two years ago, the House of Windsor were urged to disclose documents pertaining to their relationship with the Nazi regime, don't you remember?
Edward VIII was known to be on exceedingly friendly terms with Hitler - discussions were had about how the two would cooperate after a Nazi victory.
It is hugely and gravely ironic that at the same time as one of the greatest war cabinets in history were defeating Nazism, and with the death tolls involved, the Royals were cosying up to it.
This post was edited by Benedict Arnold at February 8, 2017 5:40 AM MST
I am always willing to learn new stuff and am known for my ability to revise my opinion in the light of new evidence... I have an enquiring mind like that.. but.... it has to be evidence...
The Sun????? The paper people only *read* so they could look at tits while they ate their sarnies.. I use the word read losoely there :P We all know the SUn is about the least respected paper on the earth.. .well barring some of the ones that report Trump's lies.. The Sun has an axe to grind always, always did, always will... I am willing to consider evidence but I don't think a pic like this really tells us much, they could have been playing a game, or whatever.. I need more than that..
And so far we have little to go on either way... did the docs get disclosed? We can revise opinion when we have facts...
You're dodging the issue again. I am fully aware that The Sun is a Tory snot ball of tits and garbage, but this was used for illustrative purposes only. Many other papers covered it too, and so to my trusty Guardian. Look it up, there are books and documentaries too. (You mentioned Wallace Simson in another reply. There's a reasonably well known picture of her and afkrementioned monarch grinning and shaking hands with Hitler). This is not obscure or material.
I assure you I never dodge anything.. and I did assure you I am willing to learn.. evidence is key... I am just reading the Sun one.. then will move on... If you can link the Simpson pic that would be great.. context however is everything so depends WHO shook the hand and when.
Very much talks about Edward.. and does specifically say that there is no suggestion that either the Queen or the Queen mother were Nazi sympathisers... Edward is questionable and this would fit with the picture that allegedly exists of Edward/SImpson shaking hands with Hitler..but.. as a reasoning mind would know... that still doesn't implicate Prince CHarles or the Queen
reading the article now.. my first thought on looking at ALL of the pics was that it could just as easily be that they were putting their hands up.. a VERY British thing to do.. like perhaps someone said.. who want's ice cream.. most are going to put their hand up and this seems a classic example of manipulating a pic and putting spin on it..
Then i read that the vid shows them having just practiced a Scottish jig... now what do we know about Scottish jigs when it comes to holding your hand up? Need i say more.. evidence I can handle spurious claims by the least respected paper in the land less so.
The manner of holding the hand up is also entirely different to a Nazi salute.. body language is all different too.. these are easily spottable.. well except to Sun readers who let's face it are the UK's equivalent to the majority of Trump supporters.. ill educated to say the least
Please look further into it from more credible sources if you prefer, and even Parliamentary questions. Are you a Guardian reader? Search for links there. ('A very British thing to do'? I am British, I've managed to avoid doing it. Don't fob me off)
This post was edited by Benedict Arnold at February 8, 2017 8:39 AM MST
so far the consensus is that the royals in question, the Queen, Queen mother etc had nothng to do with Nazis.. and that they were as much as they could be into the war with our country...
Edward is a diffrent matter..and we know he made lots of unwise decisions.. but the handshake was before the war and before anyone really knew what Hitler was up to...
I read the Times but the Guardian is the second best :P
I know what that's for. It ok! It was in the Daily Mail too, you know, for balance. ) Or was that for not acknowledging that you can go to an English village without goose-stepping and fascist saluting. Which one.
This post was edited by Benedict Arnold at February 8, 2017 9:22 AM MST
I think that to attribute sympathies to a kid for making a Nazi salute maybe a little extreme. On the other hand, to stretch the salute as simple English idiosyncrasies in the way they ask for Ice Cream? That's actually pretty funny. I don't see much difference from that to the mental acrobatics needed to explain Trumps reality. Is that really how you guys ask for Ice Cream over there? But, im not from there, so I will not pretend to know about you guys business.
Now, taking that the private correspondencies of the Royals are highly secretive; taking that it requires slip ups or intense bouts of journalistic investigation oft opposed by they themselves and by the people that support them, you cannot day that they were not sympathetic in the same way that you cannot say that God does or does not exist. It makes sense on some level that parts of the Royal family were. We just don't want to acknowledge it. Flirting was a verb I read in relation to this whole business, flirting with fascism. Is that so outlandish, even to an outsider?
LOL... Well if I can win you over then I guess maybe I'm wrong. An American wearing the British Crown. Hmmm???? Now that might be an interesting situation on both sides of the pond. How many heads would explode do you think?
Remember Mrs Simpson? In modern times she would have been Queen. Don't forget too the Royal family nearly always chose brides or husbands from outside the UK, mainly Europe but who knows could have been an American.
Good point. Still I think plenty of people here and there would have a personal fit if it were to happen. Not rioting in the streets or anything. Just that quiet internal outrage of the situation.
Yeah, the people who hold the English Cron are barely even English. Same was true for most the European crowns. Hell the King of Greece ( Constantine 1) during WW1 was a Danish Prince with Prussian bloodlines.
Which progressed into a long and rewarding carrer as a mechanic. It does make me cross. A few publicity stunts and photo ops and people excuse the whole instiution as being 'useful'.
What? You mean she knows how to change the oil on a car? I wonder what the market is for that skill? Thank you for your reply Ele and Happy Tuesday! :)
to Rosie and Lucia, Welllllllllllll we can say it was a stunt, but we really cannot know... we don't know nearly enough.. but the fact was they did make an effort, however small to try to do their bit.. within the limitations of her position etc...
I think the thing is... we have to remember that she was not alone in not doing much.. did most women back then do as much or more? probably not... was she in a way more privileged position than most and protected from many of the realities of war.. well you bet, but she was hardly alone in that.. that's the class system for ya.. but she did try, I believe other members of the Royal family and rich nobs made some efforts... and we really cannot say whether they cared that *their* people were fighting a war...
And yea changing oil on a car is a skill.. I'd pay her for it :P being serious we don't know, any of us, what skills she does posses so it would be a little unkind of us to speculate.. thing is she was trained to be Queen and to be honest SHE has done a pretty good job regardless of whether we feel Royalty are good or bad thing
Benedict Arnold 