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Discussion » Statements » Rosie's Corner » Once again an Answermug friend brings up an issue I did not consider vis a vis military service for all. What is it?

Once again an Answermug friend brings up an issue I did not consider vis a vis military service for all. What is it?

He said some may not want to serve in the military and so they would be very belligerent and not be good soldiers because it was against their will.

I thought yes that makes sense. I wouldn't like it. So here's the question.

Do any Israelis RESENT being expected to serve their country in the military? I cannot recall ever hearing about or reading about one who was. Mostly I think they take great pride in it but I could be wrong.

How would YOU react if America expected YOU to spend some time in the military?

Posted - October 7, 2020

Responses


  • 1493
    Yugoslavia enforced a mandatory military service. My father -- much as he may have liked the country, and looks back on it fondly -- detested those two years of boredom and doctrine, surrounded by bored and aggressive halfwits. It was during that time he read whenever and whatever he could, to keep his sanity. I'm sure it wouldn't be much different in other militaries. 

    Nowadays, he says, it is not so much military service (or religion) but the educational system that serves this intention of keeping people in check.
      October 7, 2020 5:21 AM MDT
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  • 113301
    He survived it.  Boredom and doctrine...a terrible mix. Reading does provide another place to which one can escape and I'm glad he had that option. Thank you for your thoughtful reply DG and Happy Wednesday to thee and thine. Hope all is well where you are! :) This post was edited by RosieG at October 7, 2020 12:23 PM MDT
      October 7, 2020 6:21 AM MDT
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  • 1493
    It is; thank you, Rosie :) Happy Wednesday!
      October 7, 2020 12:24 PM MDT
    1

  • 113301
    That's good to know m'dear. May it stay that way! Thank you for your reply and Happy Thursday to thee and thine! :)
      October 8, 2020 3:04 AM MDT
    1

  • 16632
    Israel is a special case. They've been fighting an internecine, fratricidal war with their Ishmaelite cousins for more than 3000 years. Young Israelis are indoctrinated from birth to believe that every single Palestinian is a terrorist who wants to kill them and their families, and the Palestinians are taught to believe the same about their Jewish neighbours. Fear and hatred rather than pride motivates them for the most part.
      October 7, 2020 5:32 AM MDT
    1

  • 113301
    How sad is that then R? How very tragically sad? So they are raised purposely and purposely fully to HATE Palestinians? OMG. So if as youngsters they constantly bombarded and inculcated with HATE of a specific "other" what chance will there ever be for them to get along? Palestinians kids are raised to HATE Israelis? I'm gonna ask. I can't tell you how sad that makes me. Kids usually grow up accepting and are easily able to get along with the other kids they grow up with. Not Israeli kids. Not Palestinian kids. Is that not a form of child abuse? Thank you for your reply R! :) This post was edited by RosieG at October 7, 2020 5:40 AM MDT
      October 7, 2020 5:39 AM MDT
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  • 258
    Since contributor "RosieG" has accepted the allegation against Israel made by contributor "Slartibartfast", in the absence of verification, I thought I would offer the following test:

    How to Recognize "Palestinian" Arab Falsehood-Propaganda:

    False-claims / false accusations / conspiracy theories against: "Israel" / the "Jews" / "Zionists", often as stock-phrases, insulting the reader's intelligence by being provided with:
    No detail(s), no objective-sources; zero evidence.

    When are falsehoods (often alleged as “criticism”) against Jews/Israel, typically due to anti-Semitism?:
    UNSUBSTANTIATED-allegations that insult the reader’s intelligence, by being typically-alleged, with: 
    No detail(s), no objective-sources; zero evidence. 


    Why do pro-"Palestinian" Arabs typically allege unprovable-falsehood against Israel? Because they assume most people are anti-Semitic and so willing to accept the propaganda without requiring any objective-verification.

    Reader please consider - Would you really want Unsubstantiated-allegations of wrongdoing, whether of a criminal nature or otherwise, levelled against yourself?


    Posted: Robert, May 29, 2021 10:06 AM MDT.



    This post was edited by Robert at September 22, 2021 8:07 AM MDT
      May 29, 2021 10:06 AM MDT
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  • 258
    The education system in Israel:
    There is no evidence of any teaching of hatred.
    Take a look under the heading: "Arab sector" in:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Education_in_Israel

    By comparison, in the areas controlled by the Palestinian Arabs known as the "Palestinian Territories" (about 40% of what is now known as the "West Bank" (Areas A and B), and all of Gaza), the Palestinian education system teaches hatred of Jews: 

    - - - - - Start of copy post by a contributor from another website: - - - -

     

    Post from Mark L. Levinson:

    Here is part of a report [“PA education: A recipe for hate and terror”,

    Jul 21, 2015 (previously: “PA Education Report for Teachers Union 210715”) from Palestinian Media Watch:

    https://www.palwatch.org/page/8399

      

    Fighting Israel until liberation is a religious battle for Islam

     

    The PA [Palestinian Authority] schoolbooks present fighting against Israel as mandatory in the name of Islam. The books teach that the conflict with Israel is “Ribat for Allah” which is defined as “one of the actions related to Jihad for Allah, and it means: Being found in areas where there is a struggle between Muslims and their enemies.” [Islamic Education, grade 12, p. 86].

    Israel cannot be recognized in peace because it is said to exist on Islamic land. The conflict with Israel is described as “one of the greatest of the Ribat, and they [Palestinians] are worthy of a great reward from Allah”. [Ibid, pp.86- 87.]

    Finally, the children are taught that they can never make peace with Israel, as this battle is eternal: “The residents of Al-Shaam in general, and Palestine in particular, are in Ribat until Resurrection Day.” [Islamic Education, Grade 12, p. 87.]

     

    This religious directive to fight Israel is also expressed in a schoolbook published by the PA Ministry of Religious Affairs. This excerpt also demonizes Jews by calling them “the robbing Jews”:

     

    “Today the Muslim countries urgently need Jihad and Jihad fighters in order to liberate the robbed lands and to get rid of the robbing Jews from the robbed lands in Palestine and in the Levant” [Religious Issues, Grade 8 ,p. 12, no date, issued by the Ministry of Religious and WAQF Affairs of the Palestinian Authority, translated by Institute for Monitoring Peace and Cultural Tolerance in School Education]

     

    Accordingly, Palestinian violence against Israel since Israel’s founding in 1948 is defined as: “resistance ... acts of most glorious heroism.” [Arabic Language, Analysis, Literature and Commentary, Grade 12 p. 105]

     

    Terminology of Disdain

     

    The terminology and lessons regarding Israel that PA educators have chosen to include in the schoolbooks reinforce the message that youth should not accept Israel as a neighbor with a right to exist. The following are examples of phrases describing Israel:

     

    • ”The Zionist enemy;” [Arabic Language, Analysis, Literature and Criticism, Grade 12, p. 122]

     

    • ”The Zionist entity;” [Arabic Language, Analysis, Literature and Criticism, Grade 12, p. 104]

     

    • ”The enemy of this people;” [Arabic Language, Analysis, Literature and Criticism, Grade 12, p. 17]

     

    • ”The Zionist gangs;” [Arabic Language, Analysis, Literature and Criticism, Grade 12, p. 104]

     

    • ”Zionist Imperialist plan.” [Arabic Language, Analysis, Literature and Criticism, Grade 12, p. 103]

     

    • ”Your enemies killed your children, split open your women’s bellies, held your revered elderly men by the beard, and led them to the death pits.” [Reading and Texts, Grade 8, Part 2, [2003] (reprinted 2007), p. 16, translated by Institute for Monitoring Peace and Cultural Tolerance in School Education]

     

    • ”By your life! How is it that snakes invade us and we [still] observe a protection covenant [dhimma] which respects commitments?” [Arabic Language—Linguistic Sciences, Grade 12, (2010), p.61, translated by Institute for Monitoring Peace and Cultural Tolerance in School Education]

     

    A world without Israel - Israel does not exist at all

     

    Aside from the hate and violence promotion and the denial of Israel’s right to exist, the schoolbooks already present a world in which Israel does not exist. “Palestine” today is said to be a “state” (Arabic – “Dawla” = state) with water access in both the Mediterranean and the Red Seas, a situation possible only if Israel does not exist. [Physical Geography and Human Geography, Grade 12, p. 105]

    Likewise, the size of the “state” of “Palestine” is said to be more than 10,000 sq. km., which is the figure for the area only if Israel does not exist, as the full West Bank and Gaza Strip total only 6220 sq. km. [Physical Geography and Human Geography, Grade 12, p. 107]

    Since “Palestine” is defined as encompassing all of Israel, the implicit promise is that Israel eventually will no longer exist: “Palestine will be liberated by its men, its women, its young, and its elderly” [Arabic Language and the Science of Language, Grade 12, p. 44].

     

    Written Jan 25, 2016

     

    Extract from post by a contributor from another website - Source:
    https://www.quora.com/What-are-some-examples-of-anti-Israel-or-anti-peace-attitude-in-the-Palestinian-educational-system

     

    - - - - - End of copy - - - -

     

    The reader may also find the analysis on the following webpage interesting:
    https://www.thetower.org/article/the-palestinian-textbook-fiasco/

     

    Violence, Demonizing, militancy-indoctrination, and degradation of Women, in the Palestinian Curriculum:
    “WASATIA Education - Exploring the Palestinian Curriculum” - Professor Mohammed S. Dajani Daoudi: “WASATIA-IMPACT-Booklet_Digital-Format-A5.pdf”:

    https://www.impact-se.org/wp-content/uploads/WASATIA-IMPACT-Booklet_Digital-Format-A5.pdf



    Contributor "Slartibartfast" also wrote:
    "[...] young Israelis are indoctrinated from birth to believe that every single Palestinian is a terrorist who wants to kill them and their families [...]".

    My response:
    For some falsehoods like that one, they arise from some genuine facts but become distorted in the minds of those suffering from prejudice. 

    What is NOT correct about that allegation:
    There is no evidence of any "indoctrination" in Israeli education, whether of Palestinians Arabs being "terrorists", or otherwise.
    There is no evidence that Israel teaches its children that Palestinian Arabs are "terrorists", whether "every" one, or anyone.

    What IS correct in regard to that allegation:
    The impression left in the minds of many people in Israel, due to the following: 

    If a “Palestinian” Arab terrorist murders an Israeli Jew and the terrorist is imprisoned by Israel, the “Palestinian Authority” aka “Fatah” and the “Palestinian Liberation Organisation” (the P.A. funded by the “European Union” and the U.S.A.), pay a reward-“pension” to the family of the attacker:
    No wonder anti-Semites display such emotional-support for the “Palestinian” Arabs !

     

    - - - - Start of extracts: - - - -

     

    IAN BIRRELL FOR THE MAIL ON SUNDAY

     

    “Ahmad Musa sits beside me, a convicted double murderer sentenced to life in prison. As we talk, I ask him if he did indeed kill the two men. ‘Yes, I shot them dead,’ he replies.

     

    Yet we do not meet in a jail cell. Musa is free, released after just five years. For he is a Palestinian terrorist and he was liberated under a peace deal.

     

    Like thousands more Palestinian prisoners, including jihadi bombers and killers of children, Musa enjoys his freedom after being awarded a ‘salary’ for life.

     

    He gets £605 every month, others get far more. If they die, the cash goes to their family. These men are seen as terrorists, certainly by Israel, and many in the West [...]

     

    Former prisoners and the families of terrorists we have spoken to also confirmed receiving cash from both the PA [Palestinian Authority] and the PLO [Palestinian Liberation Organization. ...]”.

     

    Extract source:
    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3510827/Revealed-UK-aid-funds-TERRORISTS-budget-cuts-12bn-taxes-splurged-foreign-hand-outs-militants-killers-Palestinian-palaces-jobs-don-t-exist.html

     

    - - - - End of extracts - - - -

     

    - - - - Start of extract: - - - -

     

    “The Palestinian Authority Martyrs Fund is a fund operated by the Palestinian Authority (PA) which pays monthly cash stipends to the families of Palestinians killed, injured, or imprisoned while carrying out politically motivated violence against Israel. [...]”

     

    Extract source:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinian_Authority_Martyrs_Fund

     

    - - - - End of extract - - - -

     

    Remember, to qualify to be murdered by a “Palestinian” Arab you must be Jewish and there is no lower age restriction. A reward-pension is then paid to the family of the terrorist out of “The Palestinian Authority Martyrs Fund”. Part of this funding is French and German government money who launder it through the “European (Union) Commission”, as: “humanitarian aid”.

    The “Palestinian” Arabs cynically whitewash their anti-Jewish hate-war as:
    “uprising”, “defence”, “desperation”, “struggle”, “resistance”.


    Examples from the “Palestinian” Arab on-going anti-Jewish hate-war, where their propaganda typically refers to any consequential security measures as “Israeli-oppression”:

     

    - - - - Start of extract: - - - -

     

    “23 August 2019 ... Israeli girl ... Rina Shnerb [age 17 was killed; she] had been hiking with her brother Dvir and her father Eitan near a natural spring outside Dolev when an improvised explosive device blew up.”

     

    Extract source:
    https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-49447035

     

    - - - - End of extract - - - -

     

    Israeli Jewish child Hallel Yaffa Arielmurdered for her ethnicity by a Palestinian terrorist:
    “Israeli girl, 13, fatally stabbed in her bedroom in West Bank” [by a Palestinian terrorist, June 30, 2016], The Guardian:
    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/jun/30/israeli-girl-13-stabbed-bedroom-west-bank-kiryat-arba

     

    Three Israeli Teenagers:
    Eyal Yifrach 19,
    Gilad Shaar 16,
    Naftali Frankel 16,
    murdered while hitchhiking back from their religious schools on the West Bank:

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/jun/30/bodies-missing-israeli-teenagers-found-west-bank

     

    July, 21.2017: A Palestinian wielding a knife stabbed and killed three Israelis in Halamish, a settlement located north of Ramallah. Hamas praised the attack:
    “We bless the heroic Halamish operation ...”: 
    https://edition.cnn.com/2017/07/21/middleeast/old-city-prayer-restrictions-imposed/index.html

     

    The “Palestinian” Arabs celebrate terrorist attack on Israeli Jewish civilians:
    - - - - Start of extracts: - - - -

     

    [Reported] June 9, 2016:

     

    [On 8 June 2016 ] “Two Palestinians[ ...] opened fire on shoppers and diners at the Sarona precinct, officials said.
    [...]
    Two women - Ilana Nave, 39, and Mila Mishayev, 32 - and two men - Ido Ben Aryeh, 42, and Michael Feige, 58 - were killed [...]

    News of the attack was greeted in parts of the West Bank and Gaza Strip with fireworks and cheering. Some Palestinians handed out sweets and waved flags in celebration.”

     

    Extract source:
    https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-36486918

     

    - - - - End of extracts - - - -


    Description of Palestinian Terrorist Attacks by year:

    https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/comprehensive-listing-of-terrorism-victims-in-israel

      

    Palestinian attacks of ethnic-hatred using West Bank roads, upon Israeli Jewish civilians:

    https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/comprehensive-listing-of-terrorism-victims-in-israel

      

    Palestinian rocket attacks on Israel:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinian_rocket_attacks_on_Israel


    Posted: Robert, May 29, 2021 9:58 AM MDT.

    This post was edited by Robert at September 22, 2021 8:09 AM MDT
      May 29, 2021 9:58 AM MDT
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  • 113301
    AARRGGHH! :(
      May 29, 2021 10:19 AM MDT
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  • 258
    The reader may be interested to know that in the following question / discussion I have just posted, I may have at last succeeding in upsetting EVERYONE !:
    https://answermug.com/forums/topic/128735/do-you-support-my-instant-fix-for-the-climate-emergency/view/post_id/898652#siteforum_post_898652 This post was edited by Robert at September 22, 2021 8:10 AM MDT
      May 29, 2021 12:09 PM MDT
    0