Discussion » Questions » Politics » Should the U.S. scrap the federal union and have the states adopt a loose confederation like the European Union?

Should the U.S. scrap the federal union and have the states adopt a loose confederation like the European Union?

Posted - October 29, 2016

Responses


  • Bad idea if you want to get anything done.
      October 29, 2016 1:41 PM MDT
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  • 1029
    Like Europe!!
      October 29, 2016 5:23 PM MDT
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  • 3934
    What benefit do you think such a political arrangement would provide?

    I'm am hard-pressed to think of any.
      October 29, 2016 1:46 PM MDT
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  • 1029
    Then why does that arrangement provide benefit for Europe?
      October 29, 2016 5:22 PM MDT
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  • I'm not sure it does.  Or, more precisely, I'm not sure that other, less regulatory and more 'open' options wouldn't provide at least the same measure of benefit.  A strict model of more unity could do much the same too.

    Never believe the advertising.
      October 29, 2016 8:19 PM MDT
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  • Because European countries are not legally equivalent to the states of America.
    Each European country has a separate identity in language, culture, law and religion.
    The European Union is only a confederation on certain things that are practical when it comes to mutual cooperation.
    Europe is not one country in its own right as the USA is.

    On continents, it makes sense to have an oversight of common issues - such as water rights for rivers that travel through many states.
      October 31, 2016 2:10 AM MDT
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  • 5614
    No, it should not. The union has served the country well. This post was edited by O-uknow at October 29, 2016 2:11 PM MDT
      October 29, 2016 2:11 PM MDT
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  • Kinda the original intention of the country.   How it was and is supposed to be.

    I argue over the notion that the EU is a loose confederation.   It's got an almost iron grip over it's members and dictates a lot to them.
      October 29, 2016 3:06 PM MDT
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  • 3934
    Re: "Kinda the original intention of the country.   How it was and is supposed to be."

    Really? And that worked so well the Framers abandoned it in about six years (it lasted legally 8 years, but the Constitution took some time to draft).

    Damn those EBIL COMMIE LEFTIST Framers!...;-D...
      October 29, 2016 3:15 PM MDT
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  • I didn't say anything about damn commie leftist.   Some say I am one ( your guess is as good as mine on that one.)

    Yes we abandoned the Articles of Confederation.   Yet the the original Constitutional framework that came after also is in support of such loose power and governing at the Federal level.   As in,  any power not granted to the federal government is to be granted to the states.  The very basis of our nation and it's form of government is outlined as a bottom-up instead of a top-down format.
      October 29, 2016 3:22 PM MDT
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  • 3934
    @Glis -- I owe you an apology. The overwhelming majority of people who advocate for a return to a much weaker federal government (and comparatively stronger state governments) are on the political right.

    Since you were implicity critical of the evolution of the US federalist system, I inferred you were one of those "states' rights" advocates. That was my mistake, and I apologize for jumping to that conclusion
      October 30, 2016 7:35 PM MDT
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  • It's alright.   I am to a point.
      October 30, 2016 8:03 PM MDT
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  • 3934
    @Glis -- In the abstract, it makes sense to have a variety of jurisdictions which are more responsive to local concerns than an all-encompassing national government.

    In practice, there is no consistent principle we can invoke to decide what the boundaries of jurisdictions should be, nor how power and responsibility should be distributed between them.

    Hence, your assertion that any particular distribution of federal/state/local power is "the way it should be" is unsupported, and the history of states/localities abridging the rights (which we now believe should be universal) of citizens suggests granting more power at the state and local level has drawbacks as well as advantages.
      October 30, 2016 8:14 PM MDT
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  • Agreed, there needs to be a balance. Each one has to keep the other in check. 
    I get what you were thinking I was implying.   I support a certain amount of states rights but those who champion it tend to take it way too far.  Same goes for those who oppose the idea.
    Really my first comment wasn't trying to support either side.   Just say that we have that to an extent and as you said have had a previous system where the power was way to loose.
      October 30, 2016 8:50 PM MDT
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  • 1029
    It's still looser than the U.S.
      October 29, 2016 4:24 PM MDT
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  • Pfft.   Not really.   How do you figure?  The EU is pretty heavy handed.
      October 29, 2016 4:28 PM MDT
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  • 1029
    For one thing, Britain is pulling out of the EU.  It's called the Brexit.  Ever hear of that?  By comparison, California, for example, can't pull out of the union.  That's one way the EU is looser.  The following link is a good brief explanation of how the EU is not a nation-state like the U.S. 

    http://carleton.ca/ces/eulearning/introduction/what-is-the-eu/extension-is-the-eu-a-federation-or-a-confederation/
      October 29, 2016 5:27 PM MDT
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  • True.  It's worth noting the states have much more economic liberties and ability to set their own standards than EU nations do under the EU banner.  Not to mention the states only have to abide by the rules set by their own countries government.  An EU nation is bound by the decisions of other foreign nations influence.  It would be like having Mexico and Canada having a say in our policies and laws.  
      October 30, 2016 8:53 PM MDT
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  • 2500
    Of course California or any other State can leave the Union should they want to for some crazy reason. It's just not a very easy process. The most obvious way would be by Constitutional amendment which, in essence, means that they have to receive permission from 37 of their neighbors. Don't hold your breath on that one though, just like don't hold your breath on California (or any other State) breaking up into smaller States. 
      October 30, 2016 9:13 PM MDT
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  • 5354
    But then Texas (or California) might secede from the union. Both are huge tax paying states so we dont want that ;-))
      October 29, 2016 8:19 PM MDT
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  • 17600
    We had that before, didn't we? 
      October 29, 2016 9:58 PM MDT
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  • 46117
    Oh sure.  That would bring chaos and disorder to a brand new level unheard of in this neck of the woods. 

    By the time we are done, we will not need to fight Russia or China.  We can fight Montana and Alabama.
      October 29, 2016 10:01 PM MDT
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  • 1029
    Can you imagine the Governor of Montana armed with nukes?  Scary!!
      October 30, 2016 7:22 PM MDT
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  • 46117
    The Prosecution rests.
      October 30, 2016 7:53 PM MDT
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