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Discussion » Questions » Politics » See, its not that scaling back levels of government subsidy is such a bad thing its just that how much does welfare and healthcare
O-uknow

See, its not that scaling back levels of government subsidy is such a bad thing its just that how much does welfare and healthcare

contribute to national debt and why do things that might contribute more escape cuts?

Posted - December 3, 2017
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Responses


  • 46117
    If I tell you, I'll have to kill you.  Trumps proposition is OF COURSE not thought out at all.  And ?  IN SANE.

    According to Trump we will save a trilliion dollars by cutting 6 million people from welfare.  That's nice.  What then?  He thinks we have jobs for them.  He thinks that companies that have jobs want these people.  They DO NOT.  You do not put the unskilled in jobs they cannot do.  In a few months they will be unemployed and again?  Back to unemployment.

    That has to cost more than leaving them where they are at now.  If you want to save money? Spend some on better job training and education to get those skills.

    No.  Not Trump.  Just make a big loud stupid ass statement and say TRILLIONS and idiots like the filthy rich will eat that right up.  Sure, make those lazy bums work like WE DO.  We who have a college degree and mommy and daddy to save our asses when we don't do so well, Donnie. You should know.  You are one of those morons. 

    And now you think you are going to dictate to the American people who needs to go to work?  You haven't the brains or the guts to make anything work, Mr. Bankruptcy KING.

    President Trump became famous for saying "You're fired." Now he wants to be known for saying, "You're hired!"

    Trump appears to want at least 6 million Americans off government aid and into full-time jobs.

    "If you're on food stamps and able-bodied, we need you to go to work," White House budget director Mick Mulvaney said Monday. The White House budget doesn't specify how many people it expects to leave government aid, but Mulvaney said several times that "in excess of 6 million people" should be able to get full-time jobs in the Trump economy.
    Powered by SmartAsset.com
    SmartAsset.com

    The "welfare-to-work" push is critical to Trump's plan to attempt to balance the budget. He gets over $1 trillion in savings by scaling back the safety net.

    Liberals call this cruel. Conservatives call it overdue. A lot of economists call it magical thinking, sprinkled with some fairy dust.

    "We're essentially at full employment. I just don't think we'll move more people from government rolls to jobs," says economist Doug Holtz-Eakin, head of the American Action Forum and a former adviser to John McCain's presidential campaign.

    "Full employment" is economic speak for the time when about everyone who can get a job already has one. The reality is America has had over 5.7 million job openings for months.

    It sounds simple: Take those unemployed people and put them on the front door of companies seeking workers.

    The problem is: Companies don't want these workers. Why? They don't have the skills to do those jobs. This post was edited by WM BARR . =ABSOLUTE TRASH at December 4, 2017 8:17 AM MST
      December 3, 2017 8:07 PM MST
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  • 13395
    'Welfare to work'  -the provincial government in BC tried that about 20 years ago,  the way it was set-up (make a long story short) got a lot of people cut off welfare and homeless. Increased cost of emergency health care,  police and fire fighters et al amounted to significantly more than keeping people on the dole. Big fail.
      December 3, 2017 8:42 PM MST
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  • 46117
    GO DONALD GO.

    I mean really GO. Get the FK out of the White House.



      December 3, 2017 8:50 PM MST
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  • 5354
    I guess a lot depends of who is implementing the health care.
    Obama reduced deficits while implementing the affordable healr care act
    Trump is increasing deficits while axing the affordable health care act and lowering taxes.
    It is kinda like a seesaw

    I don't know which color belong with which party, but for what it is worth, it seems the blues are on top in the picture
      December 3, 2017 10:40 PM MST
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  • 19937
    "Working-class whites are the biggest beneficiaries of federal poverty-reduction programs, even though blacks and Hispanics have substantially higher rates of poverty, according to a new study to be released Thursday by the Center on Budget and Policy Priorities.

    Government assistance and tax credits lifted 6.2 million working-class whites out of poverty in 2014, more than any other racial or ethnic demographic. Half of all working-age adults without college degrees lifted out of poverty by safety-net programs are white; nearly a quarter are black and a fifth are Hispanic."

                                * * *
    “A missing element of the political conversation has been the degree to which government programs are important to the working class in general, and the white working class in particular,” Shapiro said. “Many of these programs could be the subject of dramatic cuts over the next year. Rather than helping the working class address their basic needs and escape from poverty, the potential political agenda is going to push precisely in the opposite direction.”

    What is also important to note is that "working-class whites drawn to President Trump’s campaign may be particularly hard hit by the policies of the Trump administration and congressional Republicans.  ..."

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2017/02/16/the-biggest-beneficiaries-of-the-government-safety-net-working-class-whites/?utm_term=.33e5397ecbf8
    This post was edited by SpunkySenior at December 4, 2017 10:08 PM MST
      December 4, 2017 8:33 AM MST
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  • 46117
    Did you ever go into a welfare office of any kind?  There are equal mixes of all races.  ALL RACES.  And if working class whites get jobs, it is because they are better able to do them because they are legal and they are not pregnant and barefoot when they come into the office with 3 kids hanging on to their skirts.

    These people need more help than a handout.  I have gardeners that are Hispanic who work harder than anyone around.  They will do the jobs if they can have access to them.  The people that can make a go of it with this aid are the people that succeed and they are NOT ALL WHITE.

    This is a biased nonsensical study that really proves nada.

    Has it taken into account at ALL why people are not working?  Of course, there are lazy bums, there are lazy bums that suck off the tit of the company they work for and are do-nothings.   They show up and take a pay check.

    Anyway, I digress.  Many people would love to work, but they are so downtrodden, they have mental issues that are not addressed.  There is more to getting  a job and being successful than merely getting hired ANYWHERE at all.

    You have to be in decent shape to perform.  And this means both mentally and physically-- or we are just putting a band-aid on the problem and it will get worse when the person gets canned because he cannot do the work.

    Then what? This post was edited by WM BARR . =ABSOLUTE TRASH at December 4, 2017 8:50 AM MST
      December 4, 2017 8:42 AM MST
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  • 19937
    It was not my intention to start a race war here, Sharonna.  No, I haven't gone into a welfare office and yes, I do realize that there are people of all races in there.  Whose fault is it that someone goes in with three kids hanging on their skirts?  The study was done on working class people on welfare of all races.  It merely points out that the largest number of them are white. 

    Yes, they do need more help than a handout, but this study is not about people who rely solely on welfare and other benefits - it is about WORKING people who need that extra help.  And nowhere does it say that only those who succeed are white. 

    My point is that the ones who will be hurt most by GOP cuts are the ones who are in the Trump camp.

    Try the decaf next time.
      December 4, 2017 8:55 AM MST
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  • 46117
    Of course not. I never felt that you said anything LIKE that.  You are not listening to me either.  I get what the article is supposed to be saying.  I am telling you why it is full of crap.

    I am addressing the article NOT you.  It made sense to post that because on first read, it is very compelling.  I happen to know differently, having been party to disability for awhile and food stamps.

    I had to care for my mother and could not work for a few years.  Long story.  Boring. But I was there and saw how the system works in Arizona.  It went from getting 200 a month for food stamps to 15 dollars a month.

    You have to be broke and have 5 kids to get anything. 

    I don't think you said anything to make anyone think you were pro or con any specific race.

    I do not think that it shows any possible way that Trump voters will be hurt.  Yes, it SAYS they will  offhand, but we all will be.

    We ALL will be hurt.  Trump voters do not CARE if they are hurt as long as they follow Trump, then it is as GOD wills it.  

    He thinks this is a business and he can run his business the way he runs a business.  This is NOT a business.  Do you know what he said about health care reform?  He seriously said NO ONE KNOWS how complicated this actually is.  YES MORON, we all know.  YOU DIDN'T.


    This post was edited by WM BARR . =ABSOLUTE TRASH at December 4, 2017 9:08 AM MST
      December 4, 2017 9:01 AM MST
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  • 19937
    Clearly, we each took something different away from the article.  At some point, it is incumbent upon each of us to get enough of an education to get the kind of job that pays enough so that we don't have to rely on handouts from anyone.  However, there are those that will never be able to do that for various legitimate reasons and they are the ones who need the help.  People who are working but not earning enough are at least trying to make it.  The ones I have no desire to help are people who have lost their jobs for one reason or another, are offered free re-training in another or corollary field, and refuse it.  That person should not be entitled to anything.  When I use the term "education," I am including the trades - not just book learning. This post was edited by SpunkySenior at December 4, 2017 9:18 AM MST
      December 4, 2017 9:13 AM MST
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  • 46117
    Yes.

    I have an education.  I have 3 degrees.  I am in trouble right now.  I am between jobs, have been in school for 2 years, have a government grant I must pay back and I am 67.  Where is my tax break? 

    I am not complaining. I am grateful I had this wonderful opportunity.  I worked for it and I am paying back what I took to get ahead.

    What is wrong with doing this for everyone?  It worked in the past.  But I have to live under the umbrella of the GOP telling me that I should work for a living and shut up because they don't want to help in a country that gave them everything and more.  According to them, they are paying for handouts they don't want to pay.  They don't want to pay for schools because they don't have kids.  Like that is the reason for schools.  They don't want to help the needy because THEY ARE NOT NEEDY and they actually think all the money that comes their way free and clear belongs to them.

    The rich and entitled rule this country and they really do not give a crap whether it hurts anyone, even their own.  Because in this country it is ME for ME.  With Trump at the helm.

    Did you notice when you go in a grocery store now?  Every cashier asks for a donation?

    For Wounded Warriors, for Animal Cruelty, for Crippled Kids etc etc so we paupers can feel guilty for not giving.

    The store gets a tax break for this.  Nice?   The point is, we are being browbeaten to believe this is OUR problem.  This is NOT our problem.  I give enough. 

    Ask the billionaires to handle it.

    The rich ones.  The other ones are ignoramuses that believe Trump will make them rich like their rich GOP brothers.





      December 4, 2017 9:26 AM MST
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  • 19937
    I'm not going to comment on your personal situation as that would not be fair since I don't know you and your circumstances. 

    Can you honestly say that the education system improved at all during the Obama administration?  You can open school after school, but if kids have no desire to learn or attend and quit before they are employable, whose fault is that?  When did it become fashionable to be dumb?  Not everyone can be a rock star or a sports phenom.  I'm sure there are countless kids from low income families who are committed to doing well in school.  If the school your child attends is sub-par, where are the parents complaining to the Board of Education to do something about it?  I've read about at least three kids who came here from another country who have worked hard, maintained their grades in the face of all odds, and every single one of them applied to and was accepted by 7 0r 8 Ivy League colleges who were willing to give them full scholarships.  If they can do something like that, why can't the average kid turn out to have enough education or skill to become employed?  How many poor electricians or plumbers do you know? 

    I don't contribute in the stores.  I make my contributions by check or on my credit card so that at the end of the year, I can claim that charitable deduction.  However, remember that while the store may gain an advantage, there are children who are also benefitting from what we give. 
      December 4, 2017 2:16 PM MST
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  • 46117
    Yeah, I really started going off in all directions.

    The lack of school quality is not going up; it is going away.

    Michelle Obama did a lot to bring this issue to the forefront and it is now just a memory.  So, yes.  He helped.

    And what does Obama have to do with this monster? 

    Did Obama encourage morons?  Did he say I love the uneducated? 

    Please do not confuse TRUMP's atrocities with blaming Obama.  It will fall on the deafest of ears.

    Obama was filled with problems.  He was cleaning up Bush.  He was trying to get things done with a House of Republicans who thwarted his every move.  He should have known better, but he didn't

    That is a far cry from this PIG.

    The Republican party actually nominated a moron who attacked President Obama as a traitor.
    He attacked him and said he was complicit in the Orlando terrorist attack

    He attacked him for having lower approval ratings that Putin.  Like Putin's were REAL.
    He lied and attacked Obama for being born in another country.

    HE ATTACKED HIM AS THE FOUNDER OF ISIS. 

    He attacked Carly Fiorona for her face, and Hillary Clinton for her looks

    Megan Kelley for having blood coming out of her whatever

    He attacked women who had abortions and said they must be punished.

    He attacked a New York Times reporter who had an illness that made his arms flay around.

    Attacked Judge Curiel because he was Mexican

    Elizabeth Warren

    He attacked US troops in Iraq and said they stole millions.

    He lied about opposing war in Iraq when there is a tape of him saying it.

    He LIED about his 6 million dollar contribution to Veterans from his telethon

    He lied about debating Bernie Sanders for charity.


    I have a list of pages of this. 

    Anyone of these accusations would have cost anyone else the election.

    Anyone else would be in jail by now.

    Don't bring OBAMA into this.  Don't even bring BUSH into this. 
      December 4, 2017 2:37 PM MST
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  • 19937
    Don't bring up Bush, and don't bring up Obama, and don't bring up this issue or that issue.  You know what, I believe it's time to end this conversation.  You are so angry that you have failed to realize that you and I are on the same page and I cannot argue against myself.  Try to have a good evening.
      December 4, 2017 4:22 PM MST
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  • 5614
    When and where are you running for office? I want to encourage all to vote for you :)
      December 4, 2017 10:08 PM MST
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  • 19937
    Thanks for the vote of confidence. :)
      December 5, 2017 5:04 AM MST
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  • 373
    One thing that is costing Americans so much is the for-profit health "care" system. It's been proven that a single-payer not-for-profit system is MUCH cheaper. I don't expect Americans to ever understand this.
      December 4, 2017 4:00 PM MST
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  • 5614
    Is cheaper, better? Help me to understand.
      December 4, 2017 10:12 PM MST
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  • 373
    Yes it is. With no profit there is MORE money to spend on actual healthcare. I'm saying whatever profit that a for=profit company makes is put into healthcare.
      December 14, 2017 9:37 AM MST
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  • 5354
    According to quitea a lot of studiess that seems to be the case. Our good doctors keep getting headhunted by American hospitals, but despite the much better pay they tend to return after a year  or so, not liking it. This post was edited by JakobA the unAmerican. at December 15, 2017 3:01 PM MST
      December 15, 2017 3:00 PM MST
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