What point is that? That you abhor our president? That Americans disgust you? Those are opinions to which you are entitled, and have made abundantly clear. That you think rather highly of yourself? Again, you are entitled to your opinion, it is not shared by all. That we have no clue how the rest of the world perceives us? Actually, we are well aware...many go to great lengths to come here, as for the ones like you, frankly we don't give a damn.
interesting response... and kinda what i have come to expect... sadly based on a rather erm lack of perspective of reality... you guys are NOT the superpower you believe yourselves to be... I cannot say more.. please remember I am among the lions den here and experience has taught me that certain realities cannot be stomached... I am very hindered.. but it is what it is...
The world sees it very differently on the superpower front AND on the protection front.. Please DO remember WE came to assist in the last round of America's meddling in world affairs.. and that was NOT a war that should have been started.. WE joined you when others shunned you. WE felt the same as they did but we were stupid enough to follow you anyway.. past loyalties and the fact tht Brit still does, and perhaps always will identify more with AMerica than Europe..
On the military front too please DO remember that NATO protects us... NOT the States.. an American friend assures me the US would come help us if we needed it.. and again that's from that reciprocal loyalty I mentioned earlier.. Brits and US have a bond... like it or not.. SO it's NATO.. and THAT'S something we contribute our fair share to... so please do get real and get over this high and mightly feeling.. it's misplaced.. we KNOW it exists... it's kinda what hinders my ability to speak freely.. but it is misplaced...
Talking of sensitivities.. this is exactly what i mean.. when you say.. it's bad form to criticise you... I mean America not you personally here.. America has long had this opinion, misplaced again that they are the best.. and they have long had this defensive inability to take ANY even slight criticism.. but lets take a step back here.. I DIDNT criticise America.. I JUST said that America are out of touch with how the world perceives them.. that's not opinion it's fact and is well known.. so see I DIDNT even criticise you... so your comments were a tad overly defensive were they not?? Unless you think saying America is out of touch with world perception IS a criticism?? Hmm an i thought this was the land of free speech?? A person can get shot down now for saying even that??? sensitive much?
Lastly... I am nothing if not fair. we don't have proportional representation in voting either.. so your comments re college system are unnecessary.. I am well aware, as you would know that the popular vote was not for Trump... you are well aware too that the idiot has offended MOST of the rest of the world and you should be aware that that reflects badly on America.. it is what it is no need to shoot the messenger...
I never said it wasn't the Brits who brought the system over.. as I say we have very loosely unproportional representation system. I never said otherwise.. it all goes back to that close tie we and you have.. if you don't like it change it... you've had long enough now to change anything you don't like... so I think at some point you have to decide not to keep blaming Brits for everything :P ok that was a joke but you see what I mean.. we do have a bond... it's good and bad sometimes... it is what it is.. we are alike but we are worlds apart.. but we do share some things in common and America is sorta loosely made up of Brit descendants.. :)
To tell the truth Senior.. i shouldnt be shocked.. but I often am... when something pretty tame and mild I say gets feathers ruffled.. especially you.. I didn't criticise.. I despise Trump.. I DO blame that there were people there idiot enough to vote for him... so what? That's personal opinion and yea the world in general feels the same.. so what - you feel the need to get pissed at me for it? Unwarranted.. my friend.. take a step back here.. am i entitled to an opinion? Is that opinion shared by many there? yes... so why does the fact I said it offend you? Its because you are being defensive.. there's no need it was misplaced - just saying... I am among Americans.. they talk about American things.. what should I DO? say nothing? Or try to participate? Anyway.. I am sorry you felt the need to say all that..
I don't believe that anywhere in my response to you I said you didn't have a right to an opinion. Clearly, in MANY words, you have expressed that. Not the super power we believe ourselves to be? Then what other country exceeds ours? If the UK was foolish enough to back up a war that never should have begun (and I agree that it should never have happened), that is somehow OUR fault? Perhaps your Mr. Blair should have spent less time kissing Bush's derriere and more time thinking about what they were getting into. NATO protects you? Who is the largest country in NATO? Who contributes the largest amount of money to NATO? You have criticized many/most Americans for voting Trump into office. If that isn't a criticism of the American people, I don't know what is and, since you admit that he was not elected via the popular vote, is an unwarranted one at best. We didn't elect someone YOU like, so you YOU'RE angry.
What you said was far from tame and mild. It was an outright slap at our people and our system of government. If you think the majority of the American people are unaware of what an awful man Trump is and how much damage he has and will likely cause this country, you are wrong. The same way you don't go around bad-mouthing your own government to the world, neither do we. It doesn't mean we're unaware of our problems, we just don't feel the need to air our dirty laundry in public and, in case I haven't made myself perfectly clear, we don't take kindly to those who don't even live in our country, bad-mouthing it either.
Participate all you want, I'm not here to deny you your opinion, but don't get your panties in a bunch when those you criticize give it back in spades. Have a nice day. I don't see any need to continue this conversation - we've both made our positions known.
This post was edited by SpunkySenior at May 2, 2017 11:48 AM MDT
Very true. She dishes and dishes but when it's returned, she gets all defensive. I'd probably get as upset as she like to believe IF her opinion meant anything to me. As it is, the only thing I have issue with is her generalizing everything and painting all of us with one stroke. Bless her heart!!
I understand. She seems to think if she writes a novel, it means she knows what she's talking about and that, of course, she's always right. I doubt very many people here actually waste their time reading the whole of what she writes.
You are so right we were utterly stupid to go to war, I've never said otherwise... but the country was against it.. Blair is being tried for war crimes..he lied... and it was not the will of the people... I never said it was your fault.. so best be clear on that point....Blair was criticised at the time for being a lap dog.. and hey lookie I am happy and open about criticising MY government... but that's not really the point. the point was that you are either unwittingly or knowingly, disappointingly buying into the known stereotypical American oversensitivity to perceived criticsism.. I said something anyone else could have said.. but because I am an outsider... a feringer :P this results in defensiveness.. Americans are known for this... you brought the superpower thing up.. ALL i said was that the world perceives things very differently ... I accept that this is a very sensitive point for Americans.
We could argue the toss all day... and that'd be fun.. but we all know I am outnumbered here.. so even if \I were right I'd be wrong.. remember tho NATO - mostly DOES NOT back the US.. you might be the biggest but are you the most influential? These are things Americans refuse to even consider in their unshakable belief that they are the best.. I am just the messenger...
The world doesn't want America to be the policeman.. they cringe in terror hoping American wont stick their self serving nose into anything else they shouldn't and start another war...
Factually I have never said most Americans voted for Trump.. I am on record here for saying that the popular vote was not for Trump - indeed as I say I get villified no matter what as I have been insulted for saying that the popular vote was not for Trump.. damned if I do and damned if i don't lol but again that's the point... fact remains it's shocking to most of the world that as many voted for him as did and that he was even in the running... it speaks volumes.. again don't shoot the messenger - and please don't claim I said things I didn't
FACTUALLY you are way off and incorrect in saying I am angry that you didn't vote for the one I liked.. remember I am an outsider... we rarely respect the idiots that get voted in there :P i have no allegiance to anyone there.. we as a country considered Hilary spoke like a sane person compared to the ravings of a mad man Trump.. but it goes no deeper than that.... SO factually you should take back your accusation there.. it was unfounded and wrong. it does you discredit to claim I cared who you voted in.. we all laughed like drains over Reagan and Bush.. the only reason we care now is cos Trump is an idiot who is repugnant to most sentient beings and who threatens the whole world with his madness..
"What you said was far from tame and mild. It was an outright criticism of our people and our system of government. " sorry you have felt offended = as i say it's oversensitive... unfactual.. unwarranted... so there's no need for you to be so upset... please look again at what I said... "it's changed how I look at America.. that they could appoint something so utterly revolting and vile... so abhorrent to the rest of the world.. ... it's made me change how I feel.. I have had to come to terms with it... and I am afraid that much as I love many Americans... i have had to adjust my thinking to the stance that ... ok I had better not say...." factually I never mentioned the electoral system.. i never said most or many... I merely said I had had to shift my thinking in order to assimilate the situation...and I DID express a love of Americans.. I have said before and will again.. I care about America lol even if most of them are ungrateful regarding my concern :P so I am sorry you have taken your own interpretation here and I am also sorry that it's caused you to react in a way that seems over sensitive.. I am just saying... and unfortunately it fits with what is known, the sterotypical view whereby Americans are considered highly oversensitive when it comes to even perceived criticism.. look at what I said.. the spin or perceived criticism you put on it is your own.. I promise you.. it's as if I say something and you hear something entirely different.. and it makes you feel defensive.. Just a small point.. I expressed an opinion.. WHY on earth do you care that i have had to adjust my thinking about America? Why are you so concerned... I think it's perhaps because you know this is how the world generally perceives things too.. not that I even specified how I felt... I kept it very general so as to avoid criticism... hmmm
I AM used to this. it's why i said what I said.. in a very non specific way - and it's exactly why I DONT criticise specifically.. even the merest hint brings out this kind of behaviour.. insults about Brits.. wars... that WE gave you this system etc which really weren't called for but hey I can take that on the chin...we accept our faults and understand it's just American defensiveness
FWIW We DO openly criticise out own government we also discuss our problems and failings openly.. see above...it's again the defensive and over sensitive American stance that would shoot me for saying something JUST Because I am not American... that you'd tolerate an American saying it...well that was my point. defensiveness.. over sensitivity to perceived criticism.. and in actuality you are pretty much admitting that...'we don't take kindly to those who don't even live in our country, bad-mouthing it either.' that's what this is all about.... exactly what I am saying... :) but put yourself in my position.. I am hanging out on a site predominantly American... whatever I say will be resented by those who have this rather defensive attitude... so either i cannot comment at all... or??
My panties are just fine thanks for your concern..
This post was edited by Adaydreambeliever at April 28, 2017 2:48 PM MDT
"we as a country considered Hilary spoke like a sane person compared to the ravings of a mad man Trump".. REALLY! So now you speak for the whole of the UK, tell me who appointed you as spokesperson? Everyone I know in Britain and the news I read said no such thing about Hillary, in fact I was in a supermarket queue where one person made a remark about the US elections and the sniggering that went on about Hillary was unanimous so that was a general selection of people.
I agree with you and I've made this point before to the person in question. People from other countries who go on UK websites to criticize the government gets their backsides kicked and told to shut up it's not their business. This is an American website and Trump is the President, for a foreigner to constantly criticize the President of the US is disrespectful not only to the President but to those who voted for him.
I am at a loss as to why she's so involved in US politics.
I don't know why there is so much involvement. What I do know is that she is entitled to her opinion and entitled to voice it here, but she has to understand that someone may stand up to her and defend their country from an outsider's criticism.
World politics are everyone's business, though. It's one thing to criticize something you don't understand, but it's not impossible for an "outsider" as you say to have an opinion on politics that affects the entire world.
This post was edited by Benedict Arnold at May 2, 2017 11:09 AM MDT
Trump has hardly accomplished anything because our system of "checks and balances" assures us that next to nothing gets done. Whether or not I agree with Trump, it is a bit amusing to see so little actually get accomplished. I felt the same way when Obama was having trouble getting things done. Perhaps a different governmental system is in order.
Bozette 