Was Chelsea a traitor? Should we know about things after the fact?

Thanks, Rizz. I love it too when others ask thought-provoking questions.

I find I respect you too. We do think differently on some things, but we can discuss them without unpleasant friction - which is great.

Oddly, it is medical science that made it possible for him to transition to her, at least in enough ways to satisfy her social and emotional needs.

The transgender issue is still enormously difficult for most people to understand. I've met and been friends with six - all male to female. Have spoken with them in depth about their choices and experiences. Have never met a person who went female to male - apparently only 6% of all trannies.

I confess that I find it difficult to comprehend - and there are so many weird issues and unanswered questions around it. But I tend to accept people's differences if they cause no harm to others.

Appropos, the war issue -- I was glad to find out what had happened. The info was spreading viral via people's mobile phones and the internet anyway - so the official statistics only put it in perspective.

Certainly, I agree with you that data about defense capacity and planning is best kept secret.

I wonder, what motivates someone to blow the whistle on their own country?
And how does one psychologically screen potential employees for such sensitive jobs?
And how might the hierarchy take technical precautions against the possibility of leaks?

I’m always happy to disagree respectfully. It is a welcome change in life and on here.

I understand your point on medical science to a point. I still disagree. He is unable to become pregnant and give birth. He doesn’t have female reproductive organs. To me this means he’s still a male. I’m not going to insult transgenders, I just don’t agree with it. 

Yeah - I've always found that part - not being able to reproduce - strange too.
Many don't transition til after they've already raised a family.

As I understand it from those I've got to know, they believed that being another gender on the inside was a matter of identity, not function.
This was all about 30-40 years ago. Back then it was still fairly uncommon. Each of the six that I knew said that they had suffered severe sexual trauma over many years during their early childhoods - male to male. They were treated as females by the men in their families. They learned to identify with being passive, receptive and obedient in order to survive. Then, as they grew older and saw how these characteristics were defined by society as predominantly feminine, they began to believe that the problem was that their bodies were somehow wrong and really they were women on the inside.
Each went through the legally required four years of psychotherapy while dressing and learning to behave like women, before being given permission to start taking hormones. They stayed in therapy throughout the process of transition, with the physical operations only coming once the shrink was satisfied that they were committed and had fully adapted to their new lives as women.
Sexual orientation or preference did not change. If the man loved women before transition, afterwards, she was a lesbian. If the man was gay before transition, afterwards, she still preferred men. Some kept the same life partners. Some relationships didn't withstand the pressure of transition.
However, these days, with so many having done the operation, neuroscience has been discovering new facts. Apparently, there are differences in "brain sex" which determine both self-perception and orientation and this develops in utero. Scans can actually detect and predict these features in unborn fetuses from after 13 weeks. While most people fall within the norms, a small percentage don't. It appears to be genetic and recessive - as guessed by scientists from the studies of certain Pacific Islands were these differences have been found in up to 15% of the population and the culture has adapted by assigning them a specific role. They are allowed to live as women and play the roles of aunties and nannies so long as they remain celibate.
To my mind, the new research makes me more inclined to see transgender just one of the countless ways in which individuals do not fit stereotypes.
I am also more inclined to see a "real" man or woman as one who can reproduce - the animal part of ourselves that fulfills the function of perpetuating the species.
Although given what our species is doing to the planet, other species, and each other - I'm not always sure that we deserve what we have. This post was edited by inky at September 10, 2018 4:31 PM MDT

I would like to start with I have all the compassion in the worldl for victims of abuse. Especially sexual abuse. I can’t  even begin to understand how traumatic it is. I don’t believe lying to and adding to the delusion of anyone who‘s endured this they are the gender they feel they are. Facts don’t care about feelings. I feel it’s a mass disservice and harmful to feed the delusions of people who think they’re the other gender. 

What we need is to do a better job of making people understand not everyone fits the social norms and stereotypical traits of men and women. It’s one thing to be compassionate to people, it’s one thing lie to and feed delusions of people. Especially the mentally ill. The suicide rate amongst transgenders is significantly higher than “normal people”. It would be ludicrous to not acknowledge the mental health aspect of people who are transgender and/or feel they’re the opposite gender.

If we based everything in society off feelings we’d be in a much bigger mess. Feelings matter. Facts, the truth, statistics, common sense, logic, and critical thinking matters more. 

Before I continue I must say I’m not comparing the upcoming situations to transgenders. I’m making valid logical points. I have worked with several pedophiles who feel liking underage children is normal. The vast majority of us realize this is complete nonsense and it isn’t anything close to normal. Their feelings are wrong. Feelings don’t equal reality. 

I work with murderers. Some feel killing isn’t wrong and they’re justified. Their feelings are wrong. Most people including some who have murdered others will agree it isn’t right. We don’t feed their delusions. 

We wouldn‘t accept a white person claiming they’re black because they feel black. We would tell them they’re crazy. A lot of us would ridicule them. We can’t change our age because we feel older. We can’t be rich because we identify as a wealthy person. 

In so so many aspects of life we can’t change who we are or justify bad choices because of feelings. Transgenders should be no different.

I agree with you that (s)he is a traitor.  It doesn't matter that his leaks were after the fact if they contained information the enemy could use against us.  I also agree that wars are not won being soft.  The US and its allies won WW II in four years.  We are still in Iraq and Afghanistan and we walked away from Vietnam.  Of course, those wars were not between people of differing religious ideologies.  That is a much harder war to win.  France couldn't dominate Vietnam and Russia couldn't dominate Afghanistan (along with a host of others).  It pains me to hear that our troops are being killed by insiders - the same people we are there to train.  At what point do we look at 17 years of going nowhere in Afghanistan and say enough is enough?

Excellent question, Thriftymaid.
Will try to find out.