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Discussion » Questions » Religion and Spirituality » Has All Life Descended From a Common Ancestor?

Has All Life Descended From a Common Ancestor?


https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/1102010346?q=order+fossil&p=par

QUESTION 4

Has All Life Descended From a Common Ancestor?

Darwin thought that all life might be traced to a common ancestor. He imagined that the history of life on earth resembled a grand tree. Later, others believed that this “tree of life” started as a single trunk with the first simple cells. New species branched from the trunk and continued to divide into limbs, or families of plants and animals, and then into twigs, all the species within the families of plants and animals alive today. Is that really what happened?


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https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/lv/r1/lp-e/0/23412

Origin of Life (lf)

  • The Origin of Life—Five Questions Worth Asking1
     

  • Title Page/Publishers’ Page1-2
     
  • Contents2
     

  • A Student’s Dilemma3
     

  • 1 How Did Life Begin?4-7
     

  • 2 Is Any Form of Life Really Simple?8-12
     

  • 3 Where Did the Instructions Come From?13-21
     

  • 4 Has All Life Descended From a Common Ancestor?22-29
     

  • 5 Is It Reasonable to Believe the Bible?30-31
     
    Bibliography31-3

    2

Posted - October 14, 2017

Responses


  • 591
    1) See this video between approx 15:00 to 25:00.
    2) Yes see above.
    3) There were no instructions, they evolved as life evolved.
    4) DNA and the fossil record would suggest that there is indeed a common ancestor and it is not Adam and Eve.
    5) NO. 

      October 14, 2017 2:20 AM MDT
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  • 2657
    I was really just trying to ask the 1st question and list the subheadings for the whole magazine (in case someone had a particular interest) but each subheading is posed as a question so kudos for answering them all. Pretty sure that you didn't read the whole magazine and consider both sides before answering all of that. I watched that part of your video when you posted it for someone else before but too many distracting commercials to watch it again this morning. I might watch it again later. (I don't remember seeing anything in the video that would really prove one way or another if all life descended from a common ancestor other than just the guy saying it but it's been a couple of months and I slept since then.)

    If you have time, read this one article and give your opinion of the modern scientist quoted within:

    https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/1102010346?q=%22Has+All+Life+Descended+From+a+Common+Ancestor%22&p=par 
    DARWIN’S TREE CHOPPED DOWN 
    WHAT ABOUT THE FOSSIL RECORD?
    PROBLEMS WITH THE “PROOF”
    WHAT DOES THE “FILM” REALLY SHOW?

    FACTS AND QUESTIONS
    What About Human Evolution?
    WHAT THE FOSSIL EVIDENCE ACTUALLY SHOWS
    ANNOUNCEMENTS OF “MISSING LINKS”
    TEXTBOOK DRAWINGS AND MODELS OF APE-MEN
    DETERMINING INTELLIGENCE BY BRAIN SIZE
    WHAT IS WRONG WITH THIS PICTURE?

    (I edited the link and added the subheadings)






     

    This post was edited by texasescimo at October 16, 2017 10:39 PM MDT
      October 14, 2017 5:25 AM MDT
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  • 13395
    How many scientists at the Discovery Institute does it take to change a light bulb? 

    They just said 'let there be light' but it didn't work because there is no God /Intelligent Designer. 

    As an alternative to a supernatural force maybe there is a consciousness force exists naturally that enables complex structures to be built to perform whatever purpose seems fit for existence when conditions are suitable. 'Course Not likely a quantrillions odds of building blocks come together by chance
    Does it take a supernatural force to construct every material existing in nature? Eg. the toxins plants, insects and reptiles use to cause pain, sickness and death to its victims and the glands or organs to produce it? 
      October 14, 2017 7:18 AM MDT
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  • 2657
    What's the Discovery Institute? Are you talking about the Discovery Channel like on youtube? Something else?
      October 14, 2017 10:52 AM MDT
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  • 13395
    No -I just made that up.

    Do JWs have their own scientists?  This post was edited by Kittigate at October 14, 2017 11:51 AM MDT
      October 14, 2017 11:49 AM MDT
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  • 2657
    Are you serious? lol

    You mean like employees that are JW's? No. There are no employees at all.
    Are some JW's scientist? Probably.

    They give the source of the information in the publications.

    For example: 
    https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/1102010346?q=

    DARWIN’S TREE CHOPPED DOWN

    In recent years, scientists have been able to compare the genetic codes of dozens of different single-celled organisms as well as those of plants and animals. They assumed that such comparisons would confirm the branching “tree of life” proposed by Darwin. However, this has not been the case.

    What has the research uncovered? In 1999 biologist Malcolm S. Gordon wrote: “Life appears to have had many origins. The base of the universal tree of life appears not to have been a single root.” Is there evidence that all the major branches of life are connected to a single trunk, as Darwin believed? Gordon continues: “The traditional version of the theory of common descent apparently does not apply to kingdoms as presently recognized. It probably does not apply to many, if not all, phyla, and possibly also not to many classes within the phyla.”29*

    Recent research continues to contradict Darwin’s theory of common descent. For example, in 2009 an article in New Scientist magazine quoted evolutionary scientist Eric Bapteste as saying: “We have no evidence at all that the tree of life is a reality.”30 The same article quotes evolutionary biologist Michael Rose as saying: “The tree of life is being politely buried, we all know that. What’s less accepted is that our whole fundamental view of biology needs to change.”31*

    29. Biology and Philosophy, “The Concept of Monophyly: A Speculative Essay,” by Malcolm S. Gordon, 1999, p. 335.

    30. New Scientist, “Uprooting Darwin’s Tree,” by Graham Lawton, January 24, 2009, p. 34.

    31. New Scientist, January 24, 2009, pp. 37, 39.

      October 14, 2017 11:57 AM MDT
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  • 13395
    There is sufficient evidence to prove evolution is factual but evolution will always be theory because evolutionary changes are unpredictable due to unforseen conditions to cause the changes that will occur. Something like tying to accurately predict the weather all the time. 

    Is the point of trying to prove Intelligent Design to show that the bible is true so I'D should be taught in schools? The bible story writers sometimes seemed well able to achieve some interesting revelations from the infinite depths of their subconsciousness when inspired by their belief in God. 
      October 14, 2017 12:37 PM MDT
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  • 2657
    Don't really have an opinion about what they teach in schools. True science has proven that much of what I was taught in class when I was a kid is wrong. Even popular science doesn't believe all of what I was taught in school anymore.

    If schools taught ID as believed by most of what are commonly called Creationist, they would error in saying the whole universe was created 6,000 - 10,000 years ago and that the days in Genesis were literal 24 hour days rather than periods of time.
      October 14, 2017 3:22 PM MDT
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  • 591
    The Concept of Monophyly: A Speculative Essay,” by Malcolm S. Gordon is far from a peer reviewed scientific paper.
     Darwins tree was planted over 150 years ago and is still flourishing, true it has been trimmed and shaped as time passes as should all scientific theories. Now if you consider the limited technology available to Darwin and the fact that this was a hypothesis he was putting forward, it should come as no surprise to anyone that he was not 100% correct. The fact that he has been shown to be wrong in some aspects only strengthens today's theory of evolution and shows that the scientific method works.


    Darwin's tree of lifeEdit

    The Tree of Life image that appeared in Darwin's On the Origin of Species by Natural Selection, 1859. It was the book's only illustration

    Charles Darwin (1809–1882) was the first to produce an evolutionary tree of life. He was very cautious about the possibility of reconstructing the history of life. In On the Origin of Species (1859) Chapter IV he presented an abstract diagram of a theoretical tree of life for species of an unnamed large genus (see figure).

    In Darwin's own words: "Thus the small differences distinguishing varieties of the same species, will steadily tend to increase till they come to equal the greater differences between species of the same genus, or even of distinct genera".[4]

    This is a branching pattern with no names given to species, unlike the more linear tree Ernst Haeckel made years later.

    In his summary to the section as revised in the 6th edition of 1872, Darwin explains his views on the Tree of Life:

    The affinities of all the beings of the same class have sometimes been represented by a great tree. I believe this simile largely speaks the truth. The green and budding twigs may represent existing species; and those produced during former years may represent the long succession of extinct species...
    The limbs divided into great branches, and these into lesser and lesser branches, were themselves once, when the tree was young, budding twigs; and this connection of the former and present buds by ramifying branches may well represent the classification of all extinct and living species in groups subordinate to groups.
    Of the many twigs which flourished when the tree was a mere bush, only two or three, now grown into great branches, yet survive and bear the other branches; so with the species which lived during long-past geological periods, very few have left living and modified descendants. From the first growth of the tree, many a limb and branch has decayed and dropped off; and these fallen branches of various sizes may represent those whole orders, families, and genera which have now no living representatives, and which are known to us only in a fossil state.
    As we here and there see a thin straggling branch springing from a fork low down in a tree, and which by some chance has been favoured and is still alive on its summit, so we occasionally see an animal like the Ornithorhynchus (Platypus) or Lepidosiren (South American lungfish), which in some small degree connects by its affinities two large branches of life, and which has apparently been saved from fatal competition by having inhabited a protected station.
    As buds give rise by growth to fresh buds, and these, if vigorous, branch out and overtop on all sides many a feebler branch, so by generation I believe it has been with the great Tree of Life, which fills with its dead and broken branches the crust of the earth, and covers the surface with its ever-branching and beautiful ramifications.

    Darwin, 1872.


    The tree of life today
    Edit

    Current tree of life showing horizontal gene transfers.

    The model of a tree is still considered valid for eukaryotic life forms. Research into the earliest branches of the eukaryote tree suggests a tree with either four supergroups,[6][7] or two supergroups.[8] There does not yet appear to be a consensus; in a review article, Roger and Simpson conclude that "with the current pace of change in our understanding of the eukaryote tree of life, we should proceed with caution" (as science always should).[9]

    Biologists now recognize that the prokaryotes, the bacteria and archaea have the ability to transfer genetic information between unrelated organisms through horizontal gene transfer(HGT). Recombination, gene loss, duplication, and gene creation are a few of the processes by which genes can be transferred within and between bacterial and archaeal species, causing variation that is not due to vertical transfer.[10][11][12] There is emerging evidence of HGT occurring within the prokaryotes at the single and multicell level and the view is now emerging that the tree of life gives an incomplete picture of life's evolution. It was a useful tool in understanding the basic processes of evolution but cannot explain the full complexity of the situation.[11]

      October 14, 2017 5:06 PM MDT
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  • 14795
    Yes...all living things Stems from seeds in one form or another........:)D
      October 14, 2017 5:35 PM MDT
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  • 2500
    I should hope that the correct term would be ascended, not descended. But from what I've see in my fellow homo-sapiens lately I'm not so sure. In fact, a lot of them barely qualify as homo erectus.
      October 14, 2017 5:42 PM MDT
    1

  • 1393
    Q "Has All Life Descended From a Common Ancestor?"



    There are secularists who insist that it has and regard that as supporting their atheism

    Islam repeatedly urges mankind to study and investigate everything to establish truth especially if it can benefit mankind. There are Muslims who might quote HQ 21:30 which says "Have those who cover up [truth about God] not seen that the heavens and the earth were [once] one single entity, which We then parted asunder? and [that] We caused to be out of water every living thing? Will they not, then, believe?" and take that as an assertion that all life HAS descended from a common ancestor which itself came from water.

    There are Muslims who might point to Al-Jāḥiẓ born in Basra, [781 – December 868/January 869] as an Arabic prose writer and author of works of literature and biology who introduced the concept of food chains and also proposed a scheme of animal evolution that entailed natural selection, environmental determinism and possibly the inheritance of acquired characteristics

    Wait till all the researchers put their microscopes away and the dust settles for certainty to emerge on that particular subject. 
      October 15, 2017 6:55 PM MDT
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